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Post by alphaburnt on Feb 16, 2011 1:37:45 GMT -5
Keep after 'em, I'm depending on you!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2011 17:31:16 GMT -5
Just read all this, Im all ears. i almost ordered 2- 700 ml barrels from pacnor today. im going to wait and see what happens with this first but Im sitting on go!....Bill
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Post by jims on Feb 17, 2011 19:30:15 GMT -5
Both Mcgowen and Savage-Barrels have not posted for awhile. Hopefully they are still interested in us.
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guppy
8 Pointer
hunting buddy
Posts: 191
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Post by guppy on Feb 17, 2011 20:18:34 GMT -5
Just got my shipping confirmation at around 3 o'clock this afternoon. Hope to have it by Monday or Tuesday threaded for a BP and on my reciever by Thursday or Friday. Then hopefully some free time to get to the range. I'll get some pics up when I get it. Later, the Gup.
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 17, 2011 20:58:34 GMT -5
I'm going to try calling tomorrow and tell John lots of members are waiting for some news!
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Post by savagebarrels on Feb 17, 2011 21:00:04 GMT -5
We are absolutely interested in everyone here. Sorry for not being on for a while.
Just wanted to pipe in and let everyone know that we can now offer a 45 Caliber (450/458) 1-22" Twist in a 8 Groove! So no longer will you have to wait for McGowen to get the tooling for this. They now have the tooling!
Also for anyone interested we can also offer the chamfer on the muzzle that you had requested. If anyone has a preference of the angle let us know and we'll make it happen.
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Post by savagebarrels on Feb 17, 2011 21:02:44 GMT -5
I think we need to wait and see if savage-barrels.com accepts my proposed contour, and state a standard breechplug. This way they can name a barrel something like "Dougs #1 700ML". This could state 700ML, contour Dougs #1, standard Savage hex breechplug. Hopefully to simplify ordering especially if they start stocking a breechplug. I talked to them at McGowen and the manager and their head machinist will be calling you very soon. I asked them if they had called yet and they had said that things were a little hectic right now, but are catching up. Jon
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Post by jims on Feb 17, 2011 22:18:42 GMT -5
Excellent information.
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 17, 2011 22:23:05 GMT -5
OK guys, chime in here. What do you want on chamfer at the muzzle? I know some wanted a QLA type muzzle. I'm ok with just making sure there is not a sharp edge on the end of the lands that will shave the sabot. Close inspection of my Pacnor appears to have about a 45 degree cut that is about .020" wide on the lands, which makes it about .015" at the grooves. There was discussion on the site a while back of lapping this with a ball bearing and a grit compound. I'm sure a drill rod could be tack welded to a ball. I will bring up getting the option of us ordering either a QLA or a chamfer.
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Post by jims on Feb 17, 2011 22:53:13 GMT -5
Just a question. Will it be more difficult to index sabots if there is a QLA? Will the lands/grooves be harder to see to do that. My early Savage has the QLA and I like it well enough but that was before I even considered indexing. I will vote for a non-QLA chamfer.
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 17, 2011 23:26:52 GMT -5
It doesn't really matter if it has a QLA or not. When I check the indexing on a new barrel I remove the breechplug and bolt first then you can see light around the sabot through the grooves to position the sabot/bullet to test. When you think it looks right put some sharpie marks on the outside of the barrel for reference. then push the sabot/bullet all the way through and check the land marks on the petals. These will be faint but visible. Adjust the reference if needed. It might be a little easier to see initially without the QLA but it still can be checked and marked the same way. I put very small marks with a punch on the outside for permanent reference.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2011 7:03:49 GMT -5
I would not be interested in a qla barrel but the contour mentioned earlier would work. as long as the muzzle has a slight chamfer it should be fine...bill
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Post by ratsnakeboogy on Feb 18, 2011 8:38:41 GMT -5
I don't care for the QLA, the chamfer would work better for me.
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Post by hoz on Feb 18, 2011 9:21:25 GMT -5
I am fine with the chamfer also. I would just like to see some of you smarter folks come up with a safe standard contour. I liked Rossman's contour idea. jmo
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Post by GMB54-120 on Feb 18, 2011 9:55:46 GMT -5
A chamfer is fine but i dont care for a QLA. One of my Knights is .450, the other is .451 and i have no issues loading them without a QLA. Whatever is working the best on the Pacnor 45s is likely the best option. I wanted a different breach plug than the OEM Savage but i will side with the majority just to speed up the process.
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Post by ratsnakeboogy on Feb 18, 2011 10:15:28 GMT -5
I am fine with the chamfer also. I would just like to see some of you smarter folks come up with a safe standard contour. I liked Rossman's contour idea. jmo I think fishhawk has that figured out, and is going to be in touch with the guys at McGowen soon. At least that's the plan.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2011 16:47:07 GMT -5
I called John at savagebarrels today and talked to him about 2- 700ml barrels . He is a rather nice gent on the phone and seems eager to do business with the dougs bunch. here is what I have settled on for my builds. stainless/.45 cal tapped for a savage bp probably 8 groove/ 22 twist 1.20 at the lug and for three inches, then a straight taper to .800 @ 26" 8 flute @ max for all the weight reduction I can get 11 degree target crown with a chamfer media blast finish
he said that they will headspace the barrel if I send the actions and recoil lugs with the hunter nose installed by me. I will also have to send the plugs I intend to use and a few fed 209A primers. I will let him chime in on the price but it is very good I think. he also said they will blast the actions to match the barrels.
Guys, i think this will be a good deal for us and he seems willing to bend over backwards to help any way he can
Not trying to derail anything anyone else is doing but this is what I plan to go with myself. I think this combo will weigh in @ about 4lbs or slightly more.
I also explained that these guns will be shot sabotless and I plan to get Tom Post to do a adj die from the barrel drop. I stressed the fact that these barrels need to be very consistent end to end for this purpose and he was confident that all criteria would be met.
Whats not to like about this deal?.....Bill
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Post by hoz on Feb 18, 2011 18:30:35 GMT -5
Hillbill,
I agree with you. Jon has been great to deal with and is excited to get us some pipes to shoot. I am also going the Savage-barrel route. Cant wait to get mine.
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 18, 2011 23:09:23 GMT -5
Guy's, I hope you understand what I'm waiting to settle with Savage-barrels.com and McGowan. I want to see a barrel that we can order that has the following. #1 safe contour that will not burst with accidental double load. #2 Savage breechplug and 3/16" (.186") recoil lug combination and placement that puts high pressure area past the recoil lug into the meat of the barrel for more safety. #3 By slightly under headspacing this by a few thousandths we can just order a barrel and headspace it ourselves, or let them by filing the primer end of the plenty deep Savage primer pocket. #4 some known consistency in the breechplug depth and recoil lug shoulder specs of a "Dougs Message Board 700ML barrel. #5 easier ordering, less chance of confusion. These are the types of info we have learned that we get with our "DD" Pac-nors.
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Post by hoz on Feb 19, 2011 6:21:22 GMT -5
Thanks Fish!
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Post by DBinNY on Feb 19, 2011 10:56:29 GMT -5
Fishhawk, Let's see if I got this straight. This proposed barrel contour will be identical to the factory Rem barrels except it will remain thicker for a longer distance in front of the breech plug for added safety in that area. It would be adaptable to the factory stock (lovely thing that it is) by sanding that area of the stock?.
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Post by jims on Feb 19, 2011 11:31:36 GMT -5
Fishhawk: Are they working on something for the Savage MLII action also in way of replacement barrels?
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 19, 2011 11:44:27 GMT -5
DBinNY, yes the only work needed on the barrel channel should be in the first 5 or 6 inches and will remain within the limits of the factory stock. Jims, I have not talked with them on the Savage, they do list a Savage muzzleloader barrel on their website.
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Post by alphaburnt on Feb 19, 2011 14:30:25 GMT -5
How much weight does the fluting save?
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Post by tar12 on Feb 19, 2011 15:53:08 GMT -5
How much weight does the fluting save? Very little. If I remeber correctly it was like 4 oz? I personally like the looks of it and will have it done regardless of how much or little is realized in weight savings.
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Post by fishhawk on Feb 19, 2011 18:23:54 GMT -5
I e-mailed Jon at savage-barrels. com to see what was going on with our finalizing of a DMB 700ML barrel. Here's his response.
I have talked with McGowen three separate time regarding the contour and getting their head machinist to call you. I will email your concerns again and I think they will get motivated by what your are saying. I know that the owner of McGowen will be visiting the shop this upcoming week. He is from Louisiana and plans on staying in Kalispell until next Thursday. Sorry this is taking so long. I just need to keep McGowen aware of the great opportunity that you and your other members are presenting. I am confident we can come to a suitable conclusion by the end of next week. Thanks, Jon
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Post by tar12 on Feb 19, 2011 18:31:19 GMT -5
It takes time boys....they are starting from scratch on this. Dont get your shorts torqued to tight...
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Post by jims on Feb 19, 2011 21:57:24 GMT -5
Tar12: I am with you on the appearance of fluting. I really thinks it looks great but it cuts weight very little.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2011 22:20:33 GMT -5
he told me on a 26" tube, probably about 6 ounces
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Post by nctta on Feb 20, 2011 0:25:00 GMT -5
Can someone tell me how much this is going to really save vs the cost of the PacNor?
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