195 grain barnes

[trb0]

What is the ballistic coefficient of the 40 cal. 195 grain Barnes bullet?

[sw]

I shoot 200SSTs from 2700-3200 in my 45 and 40 Savs. The BC seems to be around 0.265-0.275 depending on speed. When I shoot 195 Bs, the BC seems noticeably lower. A guess only - 0.230-0.240 possibly lower. IMO, the 195 Barnes may well be the best overall 40 cal bullet. I've only tried 200XTP,200SST, 195 and 175 Barnes.

[dave d.]

:)for where i live 220ft over sea level .19 works out perfect and the sst is slightly better at .21. The 195 is imo the best hunting bullet for the .45

[sw]

Nov 15, 2010 6:57:24 GMT -5 dave d. said:

:)for where i live 220ft over sea level .19 works out perfect and the sst is slightly better at .21. The 195 is imo the best hunting bullet for the .45

Well, where I live is 275' MSL so maybe that is why I get such a much higher BC.

[pposey]

Man you guys live in the lowlands,,,,,,,,, I live at 2,900 and hunt from 2,000-5,000 feet,,,,

[deadon]

Nov 15, 2010 14:09:37 GMT -5 pposey said:

Man you guys live in the lowlands,,,,,,,,, I live at 2,900 and hunt from 2,000-5,000 feet,,,,

I can't even breathe at 5000 feet, much less hunt Rusty

[pposey]

It's the dragging UP with a deer or hog that will kill ya,,,,, hafta do that in a few places and it's no fun

[dougedwards]

Hmmmmm.....never had a deer ask about that ballistic coefficient of the bullet that just buzzed on through. Do you think that they possibly have a preference? ;D

Doug

[trb0]

Where I hunt deer absolutely refuse to be shot by a bullet with a ballistic coefficint below .200. So yes they do have a preference. ;D ;D

[deadon]

Nov 16, 2010 15:32:38 GMT -5 dougedwards said:

Hmmmmm.....never had a deer ask about that ballistic coefficient of the bullet that just buzzed on through. Do you think that they possibly have a preference? ;D

Doug

I doubt it Doug but I know dang well, they don't care how fast they are missed Bullet placement,Bullet placement, Bullet placement. Rusty

[dougedwards]

I guess my point is that the difference in BC between these two bullets is of little consequence based on the ranges that we normally shoot in a hunting situation. Yeah there can be a significant difference in POI shooting in a substantial crosswind out past 200 yards between bullets that have .240 and .265 respectively. In the ranges that I normally shoot whitetails this difference in BC is inconsequential. Maybe the best bullet for the 50 cal 10ML is the 300 gr XTP and it has a horrible ballistic coefficient but it sure will destroy a deer's nervous system among other systems.

Here is some copy from Chuck Hawks comparing two bullets in .243 caliber with different ballistic coefficients both zeroed at 300 yards.

.243" 100 grain Spire Point (BC .357): -1.5" @ muzzle, +3.8" @ 100 yards, +4.7" @ 200 yards, 0 @ 300 yards, -11.1" @ 400 yards, -30.5" @ 500 yards.

243" 100 grain Spire Point BT (BC .400): -1.5" @ muzzle, +3.6" @ 100 yards, +4.4" @ 200 yards, 0 @ 300 yards, -10.4" @ 400 yards, -28.6" @ 500 yards.

As you see, these smaller caliber bullets have a similar gap in their respective ballistic coeffients as that of the two bullets that we are currently discussing on this thread but at 400 yards have less than an inch difference in drop. This illustration does not give the affect of any crosswind on the two bullets which I assume would be more significant but surely the slight difference in BC (.230-.275) between two bullets when shooting at larger game out to 300 yards @ 2200-3000 fps is inconsequential as compared to the bullet's terminal performance. Again in my most humble opinion.

Doug

[spaniel]

Has anyone tested the terminal performance of the Barnes at 300 yds or greater? I'm assuming it is an all-copper, and I would think it would lose expansion ability before the SW...but I don't know that for sure.

[tar12]

Nov 17, 2010 9:55:13 GMT -5 spaniel said:

Has anyone tested the terminal performance of the Barnes at 300 yds or greater? I'm assuming it is an all-copper, and I would think it would lose expansion ability before the SW...but I don't know that for sure.

I plan on finding out in the BIG cornfield.

[edge]

My current bullet of choice in my ML is the Accubond.
Nosler wants 1800 fps as a minimum to ensure full expansion.

I would assume that a copper bullet would be about the same.

Pistol bullets, and I would include the SST / SW in this category, require much less.

Remember that the larger the bullet diameter the less expansion that may be needed.

edge.

[rangeball]

Barnes has always advertised full expansion over a wide velocity range, and if I remember right I've seen from 900-1100fps as minimums depending on the bullet. Another thing I've always liked about them.

[mike3132]

Even if the Barnes doesn't expand off the way it will shoot threw the deer. The .40 195 Barnes is made for muzzle loading and at the rifle velocity of the .45 which is around 2600 fps at the muzzle, Im sure it will put the smack down on deer @ 300 yards. Mike

[deadon]

Nov 17, 2010 13:37:16 GMT -5 edge said:

My current bullet of choice in my ML is the Accubond.
Nosler wants 1800 fps as a minimum to ensure full expansion.

I would assume that a copper bullet would be about the same.

Pistol bullets, and I would include the SST / SW in this category, require much less.

Remember that the larger the bullet diameter the less expansion that may be needed.

edge.

Edge, I just googled nosler accubond and the largest caliber I found was .375. What ML are you shooting it out of and what sabot are you using? Thanks Rusty

[spaniel]

Nov 17, 2010 16:47:46 GMT -5 deadon said:

Nov 17, 2010 13:37:16 GMT -5 edge said:

My current bullet of choice in my ML is the Accubond.
Nosler wants 1800 fps as a minimum to ensure full expansion.

I would assume that a copper bullet would be about the same.

Pistol bullets, and I would include the SST / SW in this category, require much less.

Remember that the larger the bullet diameter the less expansion that may be needed.

edge.

Edge, I just googled nosler accubond and the largest caliber I found was .375. What ML are you shooting it out of and what sabot are you using? Thanks Rusty

I believe Edge is using homemade PVC sabots and shooting either .308 or .338 bullets. I love Accubonds and envy his ability to shoot them in a ML.

[spaniel]

Nov 17, 2010 15:38:11 GMT -5 mike3132 said:

Even if the Barnes doesn't expand off the way it will shoot threw the deer. The .40 195 Barnes is made for muzzle loading and at the rifle velocity of the .45 which is around 2600 fps at the muzzle, Im sure it will put the smack down on deer @ 300 yards. Mike

Even at .40cal I'd like some expansion, though you are completely correct they will not run off forever like a .308 bullet penciling through. I was talking to dave d about the bullet and I know he swears by it, I'm just hoping someone has a recovered bullet or any evaluation on actual experience at 300-400 yards with it. I will admit my only personal experience with a Barnes bullet was the worst with any bullet so I am a bit cautious...though admittedly it was a completely different design.

[sw]

Spaniel,
My experience is limited but here goes: Sav 50 cal 250 Barnes Expander, 45g VV-110, 2medium sized bucks shot appx 10 yes ago, appx 50-60 yds each, deer went appx 50 yds, neither passed thru. Classical expansion. 223, 53g Barnes, 80 yd shot,DRT with chest shot, classical expansion. Recovered both Expanders and 224 bullet. Now to 195 Barnes - my son has killed about 10 deer, mostly does, with these and I've killed 3-4. Never recovered a bullet, shot from 20ish yds thru appx 225yds. A few were DRT but most traveled 25-50 yds with large trails. If all hits were in heart/lung area, I'd use the 200SST. My 40 cal shoots the SSTa little more accurately than the 195/175 Barnes. The 45 cal shooting the 195B is more load critical than the 200SST, at least in my 45s. Yes, I reluctantly agree that overall terminal performance of the 195B is better than the 200SST when shot at velocities of 2600-3000'/sec. Lower velocities might yield different results. My son has 1doe tag left. I'll ask him to use the Knight 45 shooting the 200SST @ 2100'/sec to get a doe this week-end "gun" season. We'll see how it does slower.

[spaniel]

Thanks sw. Yes, the SST is a bit problematic at very high impact velocities but this is exactly why I would expect it to fare better than a bullet that is not at longer ranges. I'd lean towards something else closer in.

[dans]

Gosh I have only recovered 1 Barnes bullet and that was from an elk, shot quartering to at 50 yards. Found the 300 gr. Expander under skin on the far side. Penetrated about 3 ft of elk. All the rest, 195, 250, 300 have been pass throughs. On the other hand, 8 deer killed with the 250 SW, at 22-2300 all fraged. Killed the deer but became shrapnel. The 40 MZs at 2600 all exited even if they busted bone going in and all expanded, leaving a quarter sized exit. Tore up the vitals in between. Longest shot about 200 yards. Don't know about 300, never shot one that far.

[boarhog]

I haven't hit a deer beyond 300 yds with the 195 Barnes out of a ML, but have hit one at a lasered 284 yds. The load was a relatively mild 7mm-08 round, 140 gr Barnes X bullet, at about 2500 fps MV. Perfect performance, and pass through! I've shot the 195 gr bullets beyond 2900 fps out of my 45 cal P-N, so I would expect them to perform at least as well out past 300.
Boarhog