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Post by hubcap52 on Mar 1, 2009 20:52:06 GMT -5
Anyone tried paper patching their ML? Is this a good idea or crazy?
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Post by hubcap52 on Mar 1, 2009 20:52:53 GMT -5
The bullets, I mean, not the gun. ;-)
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Post by rexxer on Mar 1, 2009 21:24:23 GMT -5
Do you mean instead of a sabot?
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Post by hubcap52 on Mar 1, 2009 21:33:15 GMT -5
yes, rexxer. I'd think it'd be kindasorta like sabotless. I'd guess you'd have to be fairly close to bore size with the bullet though.
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Post by tar12 on Mar 1, 2009 22:46:15 GMT -5
yes, rexxer. I'd think it'd be kindasorta like sabotless. I'd guess you'd have to be fairly close to bore size with the bullet though. More than likely the paper would not make the journey.Only one way to find out... |
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Post by chuck41 on Mar 2, 2009 2:19:49 GMT -5
More than likely the paper would not make the journey.Only one way to find out... Actually the paper doesn't really have to make the journey. Only has to help hold the bullet firmly against the powder until ignition occurs. About the same as knurling. Might help for some sabotless bullets that are a few thousands smaller than the land diameter. At ignition the obturation that comes with acceleration should take care of the rest. Only thing I have heard of using paper patches with is soft lead and that would have to be restricted to pretty mild loads by our standards. If you have some bullets that are an appropriate size give it a try with some very mild loads and let us know how it works. I would suggest a lubricated wool or fiber wad under it as is usually used with other sabotless bullets. |
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Post by fletch on Mar 2, 2009 5:48:20 GMT -5
the old slug gunners used this and they lubed the paper.
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Post by edge on Mar 2, 2009 6:34:53 GMT -5
I tried many materials including paper, thin plastic with some hollow brass bullets. The bullets did stabilize, and you will see thin strips of confetti after the shot. Getting the right fit is crucial...I used a 28 gauge shotshell base under the bullet, with a solid bullet you may not need it.
edge.
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Post by artway311 on Mar 2, 2009 7:22:00 GMT -5
I started paper patching my SMI 45 this year. I located a 45 and a 40 cal. swaging die for my RCBS
press. I swaged 285 gr. and 300 gr. cup based soft lead bullets. I found some 25% cotton paper at
my local store, it is really to thick after bullets are patched they are .465, I reduced them down in
a .450 die I have. Well off to the range tried one with 30 gr of VV110, was out of AA 5744 hit target
at 50 yd. Next I fired 3 shots with some BH 209 all shots touching a little high. Small parts of patch
just in front of shooting bench. Looks promising will test more when weather breaks.
I have read that 2000 t0 2500 fps can be had from these. I started this just to see if it would work
now I want to see how good it will work. Will post more as I go.
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Post by tar12 on Mar 2, 2009 9:52:48 GMT -5
I thought that with some of the rough bores in these guns that the paper patch would not make the journey down the bore.
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Post by edge on Mar 2, 2009 10:03:19 GMT -5
The paper gets cut by the rifling into longs strips, and it is supposed to! You will see it through your scope, and it only goes a few feet. My loads were very fast since the bullets were very light and used fairly heavy doses of Lil'Gun. With light bullets, that powder is more appropriate, but there are better ones  Since my bullets were hollow I always had a sub base. edge. |
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Post by tar12 on Mar 2, 2009 10:33:56 GMT -5
The paper gets cut by the rifling into longs strips, and it is supposed to! You will see it through your scope, and it only goes a few feet. My loads were very fast since the bullets were very light and used fairly heavy doses of Lil'Gun. With light bullets, that powder is more appropriate, but there are better ones Since my bullets were hollow I always had a sub base. edge. I am on the same page now ;D I have never paper patched. |
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Post by artway311 on Mar 2, 2009 14:05:18 GMT -5
edge what are some powders that you would try, I have to say paper patching is a great deal of fun.
as for as the bore I took the plug out and pushed several patched bullets down to plug threads and
out again. My thoughts were if the paper were cut I would scrap the idea but it looked like a tight
sabot.
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Post by edge on Mar 2, 2009 14:48:30 GMT -5
I would use standard sabotless loads. When you shoot them, the paper will be cut pretty cleanly and the bullet expands into the grooves. The paper needs to be wrapped under the bullet base, not just the sides. A paper patch for the bullet is not the same as to take up the gap in a sabot. In general it is a parallelogram that when wrapped tightly around the bullet it goes not quite twice around. The paper is normally wetted before wrapping as it stretches and then shrinks around the bullet. You may or may not lube it. I have always used a sub base, but it will probably be more accurate without one...but experiment. edge. From midway:   |
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Post by fletch on Mar 2, 2009 20:55:29 GMT -5
google Paper Patching bullets. Lots of info out there pro and con.
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Post by mshm99 on Mar 2, 2009 23:05:05 GMT -5
Use onion skin typing paper or crane bond , if it is still made .
A good source of info on paper patching (16 articles ) is in NRA publication" Cast Bullets" ,ISBN 0-935998-49-7
But it will be cheaper to do as Fletch advises.
mshm
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Post by jims on Mar 8, 2009 19:11:44 GMT -5
I have never paper patched sabotless but I have used paper around loose fitting bullets with sabots. That tightened it up enough that ignition was improved on loose fitting bullets. I did not have access to different sabots so that was the cure.
I do have some loose fitting Normas that I shoot sabotless that I will try as opposed to knurling.
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