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Post by swampmen on Oct 8, 2011 12:36:57 GMT -5
If a person thats fireing a gun or bow or muzzleloader of any sort understands these are not fast ,or what ever thier not mag. thier tools of the hunt so don't for any reason try to over load these things or put the wrong bullets or few other things to make it something difference
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Post by zakjak221 on Oct 8, 2011 14:13:43 GMT -5
"a large bumble bee landed on my barrel and promptly entered it. "
Wilms--that is a bizarre story!
It pays to pay attention,even to something as remote as this happening.
Mark
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Post by mike.dawson on Oct 8, 2011 19:11:52 GMT -5
did you know with the laws of momentum; if you could get a bumble bee going fast enough and ran head on into a speeding locomotive you could stop it
Food for thought
Mike
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Post by ozark on Oct 9, 2011 10:11:42 GMT -5
I tend to doubt an obstruction such as rain, snow, bugs or spiders causing this incident. The reason for my doubts are the millions of centerfire rifles having very few blowups by comparison. Many of the centerfires have equal or greater pressure. Since it isn't happening with centerfires I have to believe that it is caused by the loading or double loading. My guess is that double loading is the cause in nearly all cases. Naturally, the shooter wouldn't remember double loading because if they did, they wouldn't fire it. What we don't remember doing we naturally deny. Where are my car keys, I usually hang them on the door?  ? |
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Post by zakjak221 on Oct 9, 2011 11:24:54 GMT -5
A Bumblebee found his way into my barrel,but I can't win the lottery!  Go Figure!  Mark |
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Oct 9, 2011 11:44:41 GMT -5
I agree with Ozark. But...after watching a bore obstruction happen before my eyes, I couldn't bring myself to fire the gun. Believe me...I did a lot of head-scratching while this unfolded.
Wacky....
I do not shoot my guns nearly as much as I used to....or should. Priorities they say... However when I saddled up my .243, I pulled the bolt and looked down the barrel before getting ready to head to camp. I had visions of nesting spiders and whatever else likes to live in a hole.
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Post by ozark on Oct 28, 2011 17:49:22 GMT -5
Insect question....My carport has a workbench along the side and end wall. Behind this is pegboard with many things hanging. Any tool containing a small hole (like a 1/4 inch socket, small pipe, or simular holes is stopped up completely at both ends with something like what dirt dobbers use to build their homes. I have seen the insects and they resemble a large fly. I know the normal dirt dobber that is big at each end, little in the middle, digs up dirt and sings like a fiddle. These are maybe one third that size. But they would certainly plug any rifle or pistol barrel they could get to. The plugs are at the ends but extend into the interior an inch or so. Certainly enough to cause a barrel to come apart. Anyone know what these critters are called? After seeing their work I examine any rifle barrel carefully before use. Ozark.
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Post by rossman40 on Oct 29, 2011 15:49:20 GMT -5
There is some other wasps besides the mud dauber that make mud nests like the potter wasp (some of those are black and look more like a bee) and the pollen wasp which IIRC look like yellow jackets. And then there are spider wasps which kills spiders.
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Post by cowhunter on Nov 12, 2011 8:49:36 GMT -5
Look at the God-awful job done on the stock. If he loads his weapon like he makes stocks, I don't wonder that he double-loaded his gun, which is frankly the only way one might this gun up. Double powder will only blow by the sabot.
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Post by ourway77 on Nov 13, 2011 12:14:40 GMT -5
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"a large bumble bee landed on my barrel and promptly entered it. " Willsmeyer did the right thing when In doubt throw out. Probably nothing would have happened there would be nothing causing extreme presssure to blow a barrel one thing had you not crushed the Bee he the (bee) would have gotten the ride of his life. LOL Lou
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Post by goosesmasher1 on Nov 20, 2011 17:16:11 GMT -5
im just glad that he didnt lose his hand there's so many things that could of happened but ill put my bet on human error these guns are build like tanks
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Post by muznut on Feb 25, 2012 9:41:21 GMT -5
Whilms I got a kick out your story but your right chit can happen Always wear a condom for safe smokeless ;D. But to get to my point who is to say the guy didnt shoot a bunch of Thors or Power belts with bp subs long before he blew his gun? Dont ya know according to some when its a CVA its the pos gun and when its a savage its always the dumb a.. operator. We can learn from these things. |
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Post by smokepole50 on May 1, 2012 21:02:57 GMT -5
I know I am late to this conversation but I would like to comment. I collect old military rifles and I have shot residual cosmoline out of a lot of 8mm Mausers without the first issue. The bores were not completely obstructed but they were not bright and shinny either. As well I have fired 8mm Mausers with bores so pitted that sparks came out the bore when shot with full house military FMJ loads. I think it takes a lot to become an obstruction in a bore that will cause a blow-up. As well, I thought the typical obstructed bore/muzzle causes a bulge just before the obstruction, not just after the chamber.
I'm guessing double charge or perhaps two bullets on top of a normal charge. If the guy was shooting sabotless and got distracted he could have loaded a second bullet on top of the first one and not noticed the slight difference in ram rod depth.
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Post by muznut on May 7, 2012 7:45:31 GMT -5
I agree I think the guy probably screwed up but I think that with the CVA's too.  |
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Post by epanzella on Feb 21, 2014 21:42:06 GMT -5
My son shoots 325 gr Flextips at 2300 fps out of his 50 cal Savage.. One day he shot the slug along with his ramrod. The recoil was horrendous, bruising his shoulder and breaking some parts in the stock. Everyone on the firing line looked his way at the boom including me. The ramrod ended up by the 50 yard targets. The barrel ended up with a slight bulge that could be seen if you knew where to look. He had Savage rebarrel it but I was impressed that it didn't do more damage. Now when he's at the range he keeps a coffee can lid on his ramrod. If he leaves it in the bore he can't see thru the scope.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2014 21:31:42 GMT -5
Regardless of how much experience we have shooting these guns we can all mess up, thing is on a self charged gun any mistake is a MAJOR mistake.. we simply cant be too careful!
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Post by willraygreen on Feb 23, 2014 21:02:49 GMT -5
I appreciate you sharing. Every time we hear about these, it reminds us to check, double check, use a witness mark, and overall just dont take any shortcuts. There is alot of responsibility that comes along with shooting, and reloading. It takes even more attention to detail when you combine the two activities into muzzleloading. The hair stands up on the back of my neck everytime I see pics like this. Thank God no one was hurt seriously! Thanks for sharing.
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Post by mike243 on May 27, 2014 20:09:22 GMT -5
I for 1 hope that he recovers without any problems. I will stick with sabots for the safety aspect. I know sabotless has more speed ect.. but I will take all the advantages I can with out the risk of a busted barrel
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lee
Forkhorn
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Post by lee on Jul 28, 2014 10:25:43 GMT -5
Would double loading blow up any muzzle loading weapon regardless of powder type. (smokeless, Subs, or real black}?
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Post by rossman40 on Jul 28, 2014 13:16:58 GMT -5
That depends on a lot of variables. Most BP guns are not made to the same standards as CF guns. They can use cheaper steel like 1000 series and not go thru the expensive heat treating process since they are only dealing with pressures around 20ksi. So a spanish made BP gun from CVA or Traditions may not even take a double load even using BP/BP subs. Then there is the charge/load, you may get away with a double charge (2 powder charges,1 bullet), but when you load 1 charge and then put two bullets (or 1 bullet and a ramrod) that could cause a pressure spike almost/or as large as a double load (a charge with a bullet and then another charge and bullet). With a double load a lot depends on where/when the second charge ignites. You already have increased pressure of the first charge dealing with the increased projectile mass with the second load on top and then the second charge ignites already under pressure. Pressure alone can easily set off smokeless powder so it happens pretty quick, and as you see with most of the blow-ups with SMLs, it happens 5-6" from the breechplug. I've seen double loaded BP guns that ruptured halfway down a 30" barrel.
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Post by leftydeadeye on Nov 5, 2014 9:10:59 GMT -5
It sure is easy to see where the pressure spike compromised the barrel. The sight screw drilling seems to have acted as a relief point. That does not explain the split 180° approx. Study of the beach marks would surely tell the story. The breach plug and breach stand strong and proud. Make me feel good. Something was in front of that charge that was not supposed to be there. Or a charge of improper type or proportion. IMHO.
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