|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 20, 2009 17:03:37 GMT -5
SMI barrel should be here any day now. I went with .50, 28" length, 1:22 twist. Initial conversation with Dan at SMI revealed favored loads are 65 gr H 4198 with a 250 gr bullet getting 2550 fps, and 60 gr 4198 with a 200 gr bullet @ 2500 fps, both with the standard short black harvester HP sabot. Both of those are on the upper end of what I want to shoot, and after reading Rb's post about powder for bullet weight, doesn't look like I can drop lower with 4198 and get enough pressure for consistent performance. Initially I'd like to focus on one powder getting things to work. I plan to focus on shooting 250 grain bullets as my main go to load, but would also like to play with getting a 200gr either .40 or .45 to shoot as well. FPS range would be- 250s- 2300-2500 max, perfectly happy with ballistics at 2300 fps. 200s- 2500-2800 max, perfectly happy with ballistics at 2500 fps. Since going lower with 4198 may not be a viable option, what powder would be best suited to take advantage of the longer barrel length with these bullet weights and net these speeds? VV110 should work, right, but doesn't take advantage of the longer barrel? Something else I'm overlooking? If 43 grains of VV110 with a 250 gr bullet will get me 2300 fps, recoil would be very mild according to the calculator, like almost 30% less than the 4198 at 2500 fps would deliver. If I could use less of something else due to the additional barrel length to get the same fps, that'd be a bonus. Thanks  Forgot- If my needs point to a duplex being best, I'm not opposed |
|
|
|
Post by Richard on Feb 20, 2009 17:13:57 GMT -5
Have you looked at all the loads Kerry B listed in the load chart he put together? At the top of the home page!
Richard
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave W on Feb 20, 2009 19:47:29 GMT -5
What size hole does the breech plug have in it for the flame path?
|
|
|
|
Post by encoreguy on Feb 21, 2009 15:17:18 GMT -5
The only problem I see with N110 in the SMI is that since they don't use a vent liner it could be a problem eroding the plug faster. Slower powders definitely work better in their barrels. I think I would try the H4198 first. In my SMI 2015 and H322 worked the best, but I was shooting 300 grain bullets. I did not try H4198 in the SMI I had.
|
|
|
|
Post by jims on Feb 21, 2009 15:48:17 GMT -5
I have an SMI barrel on one of my Savages. It did not work well except with the SMI recommended powders. I know I had some problems with either vv120 or 4759. They went away when I used what they recommended. I have two stlyes of their breech plugs, one uses a vent liner, the other does not.
|
|
|
|
Post by sw on Feb 21, 2009 15:57:36 GMT -5
75-80g 2015 for 250g bullets and 72-75g 2015 for 300g bullets. Inbetween for 275g. I'd see how the Parker 275BE shoots with about 77-78g 2015.
|
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 9:55:51 GMT -5
Have you looked at all the loads Kerry B listed in the load chart he put together? At the top of the home page! Richard Yes, I have. Excellent work and summary, but unless I'm missing something it seems geared towards the savage with it's shorter barrel, which is why I asked. I had wanted to ask about this some time ago, but knew the database was coming so waited in case it would answer my questions |
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 9:58:44 GMT -5
What size hole does the breech plug have in it for the flame path? The only problem I see with N110 in the SMI is that since they don't use a vent liner it could be a problem eroding the plug faster. Slower powders definitely work better in their barrels. I think I would try the H4198 first. In my SMI 2015 and H322 worked the best, but I was shooting 300 grain bullets. I did not try H4198 in the SMI I had. I don't know the hole size in the BP. SMI now sells their standard non-vent liner type BP as well as one that can use the savage vent liner, but I went standard. I'll be having a carbide bushing installed right away, so that should handle the wear concerns and I guess I can get whatever size hole is best at that time? What would the best diameter, and why? |
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 10:00:01 GMT -5
I have an SMI barrel on one of my Savages. It did not work well except with the SMI recommended powders. I know I had some problems with either vv120 or 4759. They went away when I used what they recommended. I have two stlyes of their breech plugs, one uses a vent liner, the other does not. Thanks Jim. What type of problems? I'll be picking their brains for sure when I get the gun, just had a very initial conversation about loads with them so far. |
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 10:03:07 GMT -5
75-80g 2015 for 250g bullets and 72-75g 2015 for 300g bullets. Inbetween for 275g. I'd see how the Parker 275BE shoots with about 77-78g 2015. What kinds of speeds would you expect those loads to produce with each bullet weight? The ranges I listed? I was hoping maybe there was a just a bit slower powder than VV110 out there that would work with a comparable low volume load but get a bit longer burn with the longer barrel to get the speeds I want with lower recoil. I'm not recoil opposed, it's just that where I hunt, a 200 yard shot is about the farthest I will encounter and the lower recoil 250 grain loads still have plenty of energy at 200 yards, so why suffer with the overkill |
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 10:17:04 GMT -5
I was hoping maybe there was a just a bit slower powder than VV110 out there that would work with a comparable low volume load but get a bit longer burn with the longer barrel to get the speeds I want with lower recoil. Just looked at a burn rate chart, and it shows this- 68. N110 (Vihtavuori 69. Lil Gun (Hodgdon 70. R123 (Norma 71. H110 (Hodgdon 72. 296 (Winchester) 73. AR2205 (ADI) 74. SR-4759 (IMR) 75. N120 (Vihtavuori) Since it seems many use N110 and SR-4759 almost interchangeably and N120 is the next slowest, doesn't look like there's anything else to try. I looked at SMI's load data again, and they show a 55 gr load of 4198 with a 250 gr bullet that get's 2200 fps, so maybe it will work in the longer barrel? My brother-in-law has N110, so if I start with 4198 at least I can try both to see what does what. |
|
|
|
Post by edge on Feb 23, 2009 10:35:57 GMT -5
I am not in love with your Burn Rate Chart! try this one: www.hodgdon.com/burn-rate.htmlIt is not perfect either! For some reason when Hodgdon bought IMR they adjusted the burn rate that IMR used to use: SR 4759 210 IMR-4227 180 IMR-4198 160 IMR-3031 135 IMR-4064 120 IMR-4895 115 IMR-4320 110 IMR-4350 100 IMR-4831 95 edge. Where 4759 belongs...who knows It is the fastest of these powders, but it is also very bulky which lowers pressures. |
|
|
|
Post by jims on Feb 23, 2009 11:36:47 GMT -5
Rangeball: When I used the non recommended powder I had a vent liner failure, it was a standard load with the Savage, either 43 grains of 4759 or 60 of VV120. Perhaps it was an anomaly or just a defective ventliner but I switched to their designated powder and no more problems.
|
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Feb 23, 2009 11:45:50 GMT -5
Gotcha. Thanks Jim.
Edge, I just pulled the first burn chart google brought up. Looking around though, doesn't seem like a whole lot choices in between, so I'll probably stick with H/IMR 4198 (will have to talk with SMI some more, they recommend both on their chart) and 110 to start and go from there, unless anyone has any other suggestions?
|
|
