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Post by wilmsmeyer on Oct 26, 2010 5:09:21 GMT -5
After shooting about 20 325 FTX's in Harv BCR over 70 gr H4198 I have decided to use this load this year. (3) 3groups at 200 yds. Largest one 3 1/2". (1) 3 shot group at 150 yds 7/8" and (3) 3 shot groups at 100 yds that all went in to 1 1/2" on the same target. The last group was with a completely cleaned out breech plug and new vent. I loaded the gun, left it overnite, and shot one shot a day like this over 3 days. That was enough for me.
This has been a very good experience. No shot was even close to a flier. Probably the same reasons why the 300 BO shoots so well...and the 300 Rem.....458 and not 451-452.
I estimate speed in the 2400-2450 range but have not verified over a chrony and probably won't. At 100 yds, the group center is +2 1/2".....dead on at 150 yds and 3-4" low at 200 yds.
Anyone else shooting these? They seem easy enough to come by and vary from $25-30 for 50 bullets
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Post by dougedwards on Oct 26, 2010 5:33:06 GMT -5
Another good example of how the Savage 50 caliber will shoot if you can find the load it likes. Although the rifle may like that load I know that my shoulder wouldn't. Whooooo........325 grain bullet at 2400 fps?? That would knock me out of my tree stand.
Doug
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Post by onecardchuck on Oct 26, 2010 6:14:28 GMT -5
wilmsmeyer,
I think you will be happier with that bullet performance at that speed. I am duplexing and am shooting the BO at 2500 to 2550 fps. I choose the heavier and tougher bullet for better overall performance at all distances.
Happy hunting
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Post by screwbolts on Oct 26, 2010 6:36:33 GMT -5
wilmsmeyer,
If you get a chance, try a few of those LBTs with the same load of powder.
Ken
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Post by pposey on Oct 26, 2010 6:58:04 GMT -5
Man that will hit like a ton of bricks,, on both ends
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Post by trev33 on Oct 26, 2010 8:34:11 GMT -5
onecardchuck,
How does the recoil of your duplex load compare to a single powder load like 60g. of N120 with the 300g. BO?
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Post by tar12 on Oct 26, 2010 8:47:31 GMT -5
Wilms, You are correct about the .458s.I have been preaching this for a long time.The closer you get to bore dia. the more consistant and accurate it is going to be.Thats why sabotless shooting has a accuracy advantage over shooting with sabots.
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Post by onecardchuck on Oct 26, 2010 11:04:22 GMT -5
trev33, My current load is N110/N120 5/65 and I have shouldered this load and the straight N120 load. I would say there is a bit more recoil with the duplex load but not really that much. I compare this duplex load very similar to the recoil I get from shooting my 300 Rem. Ultra Mag. I will also tell you the truth that I use a Sims slip on recoil pad for both guns and it really helps. I got it at Walmart for like ten bucks. It fits the gun to my arms and shoulder perfectly. Without it I would probably shake a few screws loose, not that I don't already have some loose one's. I will hopefully be posting a range report soon.
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Oct 26, 2010 17:52:33 GMT -5
You recoil sensitive guys ought to seriously look into tailoring your recoil pads.....I'm not joking when I say that I shoot loads like this with a tee shirt and no pain. Yes, a huge shove but not the shoulder splitting smash of a poorly set up gun
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Post by onecardchuck on Oct 27, 2010 10:28:43 GMT -5
wilmsmeyer,
I don't know if your comment was intended for me or not, but I would like to say I am not as you put it "recoil sensitive". I think the real reason the slip on recoil pad helps is because it provides a better overall fit of the gun to me which allows me to keep the gun tight to my shoulder and comfortable. I don't know how much the recoil pad is actually helping, but if it helps a gun fit you better for 10 bucks how can you go wrong.
Not everyone has the time or the money to "tailor your recoil pad" as you stated so the gun fits you better. I was just providing an honest inexpensive solution that worked for me, but I understand it will not work for everyone.
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Post by cuda on Oct 27, 2010 11:16:10 GMT -5
I use a Limbsave pad on mine and I am disabled I have to use shooting sticks to hold the gun up. I shoot a 300grn Remington in a BCR and 69grns of IMR 4198 and a Winchester 209 primer. I can shoot in a tee shirt with no problem and the gun fit good. But I might have to shorten the stock once I get some coats on I need to stretch to the scope. Gun fit is a must.
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Post by DBinNY on Oct 27, 2010 22:01:21 GMT -5
Glad to see your not using "sissy" loads again Wilms. As for recoil pads, my thick kick-eze made a world of difference and also made the gun fit me much better (I'm 6'-4") in t-shirt and in heavy hunting clothing.
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Post by rbinar on Oct 27, 2010 23:34:09 GMT -5
After shooting about 20 325 FTX's in Harv BCR over 70 gr H4198 I have decided to use this load this year. (3) 3groups at 200 yds. Largest one 3 1/2". (1) 3 shot group at 150 yds 7/8" and (3) 3 shot groups at 100 yds that all went in to 1 1/2" on the same target. The last group was with a completely cleaned out breech plug and new vent. I loaded the gun, left it overnite, and shot one shot a day like this over 3 days. That was enough for me. This has been a very good experience. No shot was even close to a flier. Probably the same reasons why the 300 BO shoots so well...and the 300 Rem.....458 and not 451-452. I estimate speed in the 2400-2450 range but have not verified over a chrony and probably won't. At 100 yds, the group center is +2 1/2".....dead on at 150 yds and 3-4" low at 200 yds. Anyone else shooting these? They seem easy enough to come by and vary from $25-30 for 50 bullets The reason this is a load you like and will probably stick to is pressure. When a bullet is over 335 grain (and yours is if you count the sabot) it is no longer a ridiculously light weight projectile for this caliber. It still very light weight but within reason. That said you are now adaquate pressure to ensure reasonable shooting. It's like having a duplex with no duplex. I have long reasoned one way to get the most from 50 caliber is to shoot heavier bullets. If you can take the recoil (of which you seem to be immune) it is an excellent way to tune a 50 caliber rifle.
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Oct 28, 2010 4:45:24 GMT -5
RB,
If that's the case, there all of a sudden is a very wide selection of bullets available. One I've always wanted to try is the Speer 350 hot-core. It is recommended for max .458 win mag loads....which, incidentally, shoots them at about the same speed we would...at max loads.
I am sure not immune to recoil. This gun just about broke my shoulder during my very 1st session with it. Factory butt plate using similar load that I shoot now. Extremely unshootable with a flinch and pain. I had a dinner plate bruise that lasted a long time and I repeated the whole thing again nest time out. THEN I said Whoa! I put a recoil pad from an old Rem 1100 on the gun, added a slip over pad on top of that and wrapped the whole area with a coating of black electrical tape. It lengthened my pull to a better position and it never hurts.
My gun is a butt ugly looking stepchild that looks like a wack job got a hold of it Camo tape on the barrel and all the recoil stuff....but it has become a real shooter and I wouldn't want to be a deer that has been selected for the taking. Ugly Betty bites hard, has great eyes and a long track record
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Post by sw on Oct 28, 2010 6:33:50 GMT -5
Wilms, I think consistency is easier to obtain with the heavier bullets, the size closer to bore diameter, and heavier loads(pressure). I have 2 Hg recoil reducers in the stock of my 40 cal and a Simms pad. I shoot it at appx 3000'/sec.200SST or 195 Barnes. Virtually no recoil compared to being with out either recoil reduction . Recoil reducer(s) might be good for you and certainly would make it easier on your scope.
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Post by mountainam on Oct 28, 2010 6:57:02 GMT -5
Wilms, I used the 325FTX last deer season and was very pleased with the results on deer. It blew a tennis ball size hole through the buck's shoulder joints where they meet at the bottom of the shoulder blade and I dug the bullet out of the side of the hill where it penetrated about 18" into the sod. It still weighed 270+ grains and was a perfect mushroom. I normally use 300 Rems,but the 325FTX actually drops 2 1/2" less at 200yds than do the Rems. It's a great bullet for the reasons that Tar12 and RB stated. Good Shooting!
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Post by bigmoose on Oct 28, 2010 9:24:05 GMT -5
Here is my non-expert view on recoil, [Bench Shooting} If you hold your rifle loosely the rifle will jab you, if its a big boomer that jab will hurt, making shooting it unpleasant to shoot. However, If you draw the rifle tight to you, all it can do is push you, no pain. Needless to say there are some rifles [African stoppers] that should not to benched. The reason shooting off hand is not a problem no matter the caliber, is your body rocks back and absorbs the big push. Folks that shoot 600 double barrels rifles are not superman, they just know how to go with the push. I'll pass on those rifles now , but would have loved to have shoot them as a younger man.
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Post by rbinar on Oct 28, 2010 22:08:39 GMT -5
RB, If that's the case, there all of a sudden is a very wide selection of bullets available. One I've always wanted to try is the Speer 350 hot-core. My gun is a butt ugly looking stepchild that looks like a wack job got a hold of it Camo tape on the barrel and all the recoil stuff....but it has become a real shooter and I wouldn't want to be a deer that has been selected for the taking. Ugly Betty bites hard, has great eyes and a long track record Of course it does. I recommended the Speer bullet as much as 8 years ago right here. I've also shot the 405 grain FN, 350 grain Hornady RN, and Barnes 400 grain semi-spitzer, as well. Marty (Big Moose to you) has shot many different heavier bullets on my advice but so far seems to be the only one sold on the idea. Any bullet 325 grains or heavier has a natural advantage in the 50 caliber bore. With a 300 grain bullet even 65 grains of RL 7 or H4198 isn't perfect pressure. With a 350 grain bullet any load over 60 grains is very adequate. With a powder like 10X these thing will go enough to hurt the shooter as well as the shot.
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Post by stubblejumper on Oct 28, 2010 23:22:58 GMT -5
Wilms
I too am shooting the 325 ftx but over 62 grains of RL 7 with excellent results. I've left it loaded for over a week through different temps etc and it still consistenly fires within the same 1" group at 100 yards. I have had zero flyers or problems with this set up. The load chronied at about 2250fps and I dont know for certain what the pressure is but it works for my gun.
This is the first load that Ive shot that will consistently shoot 2" or under at 200 yards. I am happy! Now to find that mule buck.....
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Post by bigmoose on Oct 29, 2010 7:41:47 GMT -5
Rick, Add two more converts, when I told the guides from Moose camp about the 400gr. Buster Bullet, they both said bring it, Isaid to Fred [owner the head guide] it made your 375 look like a sissy gun, he answer Bring it. Fred has hunted Africa {as a client} and has taken a fine Cape Buffalo., I posted some of the pictures of the 2010 hunt on the Big Game session. Wimlsmeyer, I have stepped on your post, I hope this doesn't require a duel Too Old and Too much a chicken.
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Post by edge on Oct 29, 2010 7:55:38 GMT -5
That should be a good chipmunk load edge.
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Post by bigmoose on Oct 29, 2010 8:33:04 GMT -5
Edge,
I wish you would stop making these over the top statements, While a 400gr copper bullet at 2147FPS, is a big game round, its not up fpr handling the likes of a chipmunk, I suggest a 155MM field pice with HE rounds ;D
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orion
8 Pointer
Posts: 128
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Post by orion on Oct 29, 2010 8:59:30 GMT -5
Last year I shot a few rounds of the Speer 350 grain flat point using a BCR sabot and 63 grains of R7 through my Chrony and got 2200 fps. Incidentaly it was the same velocity as the other load I was shooting which was a 300 grain Hornady in the BCR with the same weight of powder. I ran out of bullets before trying any accuracy testing. I am not sure how this bullet would perform on Whitetails though from a MLII. It seems to be pretty heavily constructed. I did shoot one large doe with that bullet at a velocity of 1800 fps from a Thompson Contender pistol at about 10 yards. The bullet made a pencil hole in and a small hole out and a long tracking job because no bones were hit. I am sure at higher velocity it would probably expand a little more; however, out at longer ranges I would not expect much. I think it needs hair testing.
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Post by chuck41 on Oct 29, 2010 11:10:54 GMT -5
Well, I am a 6'2", 240# recoil whimp! That's why I chose to go to a "40" and have not regretted that decision. However, you guys have almost convinced me to actually try those Hornady 300gr that I recently resized to .400" in it. Should be a great moose, bear or elk load. Since 40 cal muzzle loaders are legal for them here in AR I wonder how it will work on squirrels? Hornady 300gr .400" "squirrel bullet"
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Post by bigmoose on Oct 29, 2010 12:45:10 GMT -5
chuck,
A big old country boy a wimp, I aint going for it....no way.
If we ever cross paths, I'll get you to shoot the 400gr. Buster Bullet at speed, it will cure you fast, and you will able to say, I love them big boomers
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Post by Chris Champion on Oct 29, 2010 15:01:33 GMT -5
Chuck41
You have a PM.
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Post by chuck41 on Oct 29, 2010 22:11:37 GMT -5
chuck, A big old country boy a wimp, I aint going for it....no way. If we ever cross paths, I'll get you to shoot the 400gr. Buster Bullet at speed, it will cure you fast, and you will able to say, I love them big boomers When I first got my ML10-II I was young and ignorant (three years ago). Spent one afternoon at the range with a couple dozen 250gr and 300gr XTPs and factory loads. I was hooked on the Savage, but had black and blue marks on my shoulder and soreness that lasted for about a week. Canceled my planned trip next day to range and instead went looking for a shoulder pad. Put a limbsaver on it and had no repeat, but it convinced me that I didn't need that much power for deer. Now use 200gr at 2400-2800 and don't have to endure the thumping of a 300gr bullet at only 2300fps. Much more pleasant at the range. Never feel it in the stand. I will leave the 400gr "Buster Bullets at speed" to the "real men" among us like BigMoose.
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Post by boarhog on Oct 29, 2010 22:41:14 GMT -5
Chuck, I am interested in that Hornady 300 gr bullet, resized to .400, but shot with a sabot in 45 cal. What do you think? Boarhog
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Post by bigmoose on Oct 30, 2010 6:30:18 GMT -5
Chuck,
No doubt you are among the "real Men".
I'm just having fun, trying to see how far a Savage can be pushed SAFELY. Its fun, but meaningless, just like my penetation test, meaningless but fun. My best wishes to you, have a fun season. Marty
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Post by rbinar on Oct 30, 2010 6:32:51 GMT -5
Chuck, I am interested in that Hornady 300 gr bullet, resized to .400, but shot with a sabot in 45 cal. What do you think? Boarhog Ya'll just be sure to get a good load for that bullet first. Nothing in the 200 grain load data will be even close to what you need. So ya'll be careful out there. Resizing will not be as critical in a sabot as for sabot-less. I don't know if the 1 in 22 or 1 in 20 pac-nor has enough spin for a 300 grain bullet but some one should be able to tell us. I'm also unsure of sabot fit: that being, is it too long for the sabot?
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