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Post by dave d. on Feb 14, 2009 18:42:47 GMT -5
:)guy's the plugs will be ready to ship the middle of next week.pete is sending me the first plug as i write this post because he wants me to check the plug first to make sure everything is perfect before he ships them out to you guys.i should have it in my hands tuesday and i will check it out and post a pic.it's time to get the check books out the price of these plugs are $90.give pete a call and he will give you mailing info(610-923-9234).goodluck guys...
btw savage plugs will be ready soon also.
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Post by dougedwards on Feb 14, 2009 20:18:21 GMT -5
Sorry for my ignorance but what is the benefit to these $90 breech plugs?
Doug
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Post by thelongrider on Feb 14, 2009 21:16:00 GMT -5
That's good news. I talked to Pete last week and he said he wanted to make a test plug to be sure. I sure hope I get my barrel from Pac-Nor soon.
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Post by dave d. on Feb 14, 2009 22:29:33 GMT -5
:)doug the rem plugs are a 2 piece design(edges) and except a acp case for use in centerfire actions.there's alittle more work involve in making these plugs so there alittle more expensive.
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Post by edge on Feb 16, 2009 10:48:35 GMT -5
Probably something like one of these:  or  and ONLY for a shouldered barrel, not a Savage with a Barrel Nut! edge. |
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Post by thelongrider on Feb 16, 2009 19:00:22 GMT -5
These plugs look different. Do they head space off the shortened case length or the case web? The top one looks like you would install or remove it with a socket but, how do you work the one on the bottom? Can both of these plugs use 30-06 cases or 45 acp?
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Post by blackhawk7204 on Feb 17, 2009 8:07:16 GMT -5
Maybe a dumb question but why ONLY for a shouldered barrel?
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Post by edge on Feb 17, 2009 8:31:08 GMT -5
thelongrider, the Remington plugs will use the case web to headspace. The top plug uses a socket to be removed, and the bottom one uses the standard Savage fishwacker! I am sure that dave d. will give a full explanation of what to do when the plugs become available  blackhawk7204, the breechplug is only long enough to get past the recoil lug. The Savage breechplug extends past the barrel nut. Something like this:  edge. |
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Post by savagebrother on Feb 17, 2009 13:08:56 GMT -5
if you have a lugged action why does the breech plug have to be way up in the barrel???
sb
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Post by rrbou on Feb 17, 2009 13:31:45 GMT -5
I may Be wrong but if you are head spacing with the web of a 45 cartridge the breach plug is not very far up the barrel.
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Post by edge on Feb 17, 2009 15:07:56 GMT -5
I may Be wrong but if you are head spacing with the web of a 45 cartridge the breach plug is not very far up the barrel. I am not sure what you mean! You will have more threads engaged than on a stock Savage plug. edge. |
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Post by rrbou on Feb 17, 2009 17:55:05 GMT -5
Edge
I was just commenting to savagebrother that the plug was not way up the barrel.
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Post by dave d. on Feb 17, 2009 18:13:00 GMT -5
if you have a lugged action why does the breech plug have to be way up in the barrel??? sb :)sb in the case of the savage you need to get past the barrel nut which makes for a long plug but with a rem you just need to get past the lug so it could be much shorter. |
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Post by savagebrother on Feb 17, 2009 19:57:02 GMT -5
why do you have to get past the barrel nut???
sb
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Post by edge on Feb 17, 2009 20:07:52 GMT -5
why do you have to get past the barrel nut??? sb IMO, it is just a safety issue. It keeps the barrel pressure on a round barrel instead of under the threads which is a weaker area. I designed my breechplug to extend about a quarter inch past the recoil lug, but my Savage barrels do not use a barrel nut. edge. |
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Post by savagebrother on Feb 17, 2009 22:09:28 GMT -5
again why, if it were a center fire there would only be that little bit of brass between you and all that pressure, so again what safety issue are you talking about.
sb
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Post by edge on Feb 17, 2009 22:55:08 GMT -5
again why, if it were a center fire there would only be that little bit of brass between you and all that pressure, so again what safety issue are you talking about. sb Most pressure vessels stay away from sharp corners, I don't know who cuts the chamber on your centerfire rifles but I doubt that they look like threads on the ID!  I don't know what the maximum cartridge in a standard Savage, but I don't think that any are 0.687 in diameter at the barrel nut! edge. |
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Post by savagebrother on Feb 17, 2009 23:14:23 GMT -5
maybe so edge but the 300 wsm is .555 across the bottom and .538 across the top at the shoulder. and on top of that the pressure stops at the breech plug face it pushes outward on a cartridge and thats past the end of the barrel even, there is just the thrust line on the breech plug. so make your breech plug threads smaller diameter. when you say weeker you mean it would fail or are you saying its just a weaker part of the set up.
sb
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Post by edge on Feb 17, 2009 23:27:03 GMT -5
I am not saying that it is too weak, but I prefer more than a 5/32 cross section.
edge.
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Post by dave d. on Feb 26, 2009 17:36:03 GMT -5
:)guy's here's the first pa rem plug and i think pete did a nice job.    here's the area that will be needed to file down for headspacing.  take your time on this step and get it exact and you will be a very happy camper.goodluck guys with the plugs and your conversions. |
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Post by smitty on Feb 26, 2009 18:29:04 GMT -5
Fantastic looking plug ! Forgive my ignorance but what needs to be different for this plug to work in my Pacnor barreled savage target action ?
smitty
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Post by dave d. on Feb 26, 2009 18:33:34 GMT -5
:)smitty,you would need a rem chamber and you would have to do away with the barrel nut.
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Post by smitty on Feb 26, 2009 19:07:32 GMT -5
I was afraid that would be the answer. What are my chances of Pete modifying one of his SS savage plugs to hold the 45acp case  : ) |
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Post by dave d. on Feb 26, 2009 20:20:14 GMT -5
:)smitty i don't know give pete a call.it could be done but you would definitely want the recess version.
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Post by thelongrider on Feb 26, 2009 20:27:01 GMT -5
Hey Dave, How does the plug look from the business end.
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Post by smitty on Feb 26, 2009 21:13:14 GMT -5
Thanks, I'll try to give Pete a call tomorrow.
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Post by rbinar on Feb 27, 2009 1:31:43 GMT -5
8-)I do my plugs somewhat differently. I'm allowed to because I stick with the Savage action. My breech plug is 5/8 X 18 making it a full 1/16" less in diameter and the barrel that much thicker. I could use a 9/16 X 20 but it is rather an odd size these days and it represents diminishing returns.
The plug style you see here is to adapt a rifle with locking lugs to a breech plug. Since the Savage has no locking lugs using this style of plug would not be practical. It is much easier and (depending on your point of view) better to use the standard 209 carriage on the 10ML's bolt.
I want to give a word of caution. As long as your working on your own rifle things are fine. The parts (including the plugs seen here) are not regulated by law. However if you plan to mail the action it can only be shipped to and from FFL holders. These rifles are not considered muzzle loaders by law and shipping them between private parties could turn into a big problem.
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Post by edge on Feb 27, 2009 8:03:40 GMT -5
RB, these are self installs just like the PacNor barrels for the Savage. Pete is not doing anything other than supplying the plugs, at least that I have heard about edge. |
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Post by screwbolts on Feb 27, 2009 8:38:38 GMT -5
 I want to give a word of caution. As long as your working on your own rifle things are fine. The parts (including the plugs seen here) are not regulated by law. However if you plan to mail the action it can only be shipped to and from FFL holders. These rifles are not considered muzzle loaders by law and shipping them between private parties could turn into a big problem. I think you are trying to portray some incorrect info RB, I can ship any centerfire to any FFL holder that I want to to have him do watever to a form 4473 gun. I do not need a FFL to ship My rifle to anyone. I beleive this is an accurat explanation of what can be shipped: Here is exactly what the ATF 'Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide' (ATF P 5300.4) says: (B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier? A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30] (B7) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?[ A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. [18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)] 'Antique' firearms need not be shipped to a licensed dealer. These can be shipped directly to the buyer. An antique firearm is a firearm built in or before 1898, or a replica thereof. The exact ATF definition of an antique firearm is: Antique firearm. (a) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and (b) any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this definition if such replica (1) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or (2) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade. Knives, air guns, accessories, and most gun parts need not be shipped to an FFL holder. We say most gun parts because each firearm contains at least one part that the ATF considers a firearm. This part is typically the part that contains the serial number. This part must be treated as a complete firearm when shipping the item. Ken CNY |
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Post by smitty on Feb 27, 2009 8:41:56 GMT -5
Thanks for the info RB. Guess I should have given a little more info. I took a different route for a Pacnor barreled ML. I used a Savage Target Action and a dd pacnor 45 barrel with the large shank threads. My plan was to have a stock savage breechplug modified so I could use the 45 acp cases but deer season came upon me before that happened so I modified a bolt head for using 209's so i could hunt with the gun this past season. This works fine but is dirtier than I care. Sorry for the confusion.
smitty
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: )