rage broadheads

[deadeye]

was starting to get into a rage myself until i viewed the video. just noticed something i didnt care for on the video. all bled well on the entrance but was very disturbed about no pass-throughs/exits so i ask for your actual"rage" field experience's since this is just one video.
www.ragebroadheads.com/Commercial/Uncensored-Footage/Footage.php

[Harley]

Deadeye, I've shot the Rage two-blade, 100 gn during last year's hunting season.

1. Bobcat - almost cut in half, complete pass through.
2. Bobcat - ditto, but the broadhead came apart because the blade-attaching holes were too large.
3. Deer - hit in shoulder blade, only superficial penetration, lost. My fault for poor shot placement.
4. Deer - arrow bounced off; inspection revealed the factory o-ring was too small, failing to roll back.

Also, I've been disappointed in how difficult it is to keep the blades secured under the o-rings while in the quiver.

Harley

[deadeye]

harley- i value your opinion & experience's also. we used to go to archery ''dealer only''show's to get sold on new products eventually to test at all aspect's within our ability to finds some were just sale's job's on the dealer to be handed down to the consumer. i suspect this rage thing is on my failure list also but im not in business anymore so to speak. thx de

[Harley]

Deadeye, you got me thinking about changing broadheads, so I've spent the last few hours researching various makes and models. After reading all the user reviews I can't find one that really stands out, so maybe if I can modify the lip on the Rage so that it stays under the o-ring until target contact, I'll just stick with what I've got. I do like its cut-on-contact tip, the rear deployment and its large cutting diameter.

I don't think my last year's experience was a fair test of Rage's potential.

Harley

Harley

[deadeye]

harley-pretty tough to beat after all these years a muzzy,i think from your finding's with my skeptisism,you gave me enough reason to not spend $$ foolishly again especially since the intended target is elk.i have heard a few other negative reports also on rage

[dougedwards]

An extreme angle of the blade will inhibit penetration somewhat as opposed to a longer and more sloping angle such as we see on some of the fixed broadheads like the Magnus or Steelforce and others. The extreme angle also makes them more vulnerable to bending and breaking when bone is hit. The trend today is to get as wide of a cut as possible out of mechanical broadheads. That is good for hemorrhaging but bad for penetration.

Honestly, I don't know why mechanicals have become so popular. I will use one when I can't get my fixed broadheads to fly like field points because accuracy, penetration and dependability are the most important characteristics of a broadhead to me.

Doug

[deadeye]

doug ,i think you are right on the expandables,been trying for 15yrs+ to find one to that would perform better than a fixed without success. when the stilettos(2-1/2 '' expandable) first out a dealer supplied us on our upcoming hog hunt for free, i laugh now but it was not pretty with hogs running around with well placed arrows sticking in them expandables failing miserably, you could see it on the guide;s face also.

[Harley]

UPS just posted the magic "out for delivery" on my new G5's. I'll start testing them tomorrow and, depending on how it goes, will probably list my unused Rage's and replacement blades for sale.

Harley

[artjr338wm]

This is strictly my opinion only, but I feel bow hunters get to caught up in what type of broad head to use, and this is compounded by the fact that the faster a bow is the harder IMHO it is to get BH to fly well, IMHO, that is why so many bow hunters use mechanical BH's because tuning a really fast bow to shoot B's well can be a big harry PITA .

I might be out of date with my opinions as my bow only shoots at around +/- 263-266fps. Quite slow by today's standards.

Granted I have had more than a few different manufactures broad heads require much more tuning to get them to fly well than others, and two I simply could not get to fly well at all and returned for a refund.

The broad heads I have used have been 100% all fixed blade. They are listed form first to last and why I changed:

>Rocky Mt. Extreme 125 and 100Grn. I stopped using them because they were (at least for me) total PITA to assemble and that caused them to be difficult to get to spin test well, and of the six or eight deer I killed with them the BAH lost blades on II RC at least two Bahs I recovered after shooting deer with them and quite a few more times shooting them into my HM foam target(s).

>NAP Thunder Heads 100Grn. Used these excellent BAH to kill +/- about 14 of my 25 archery killed deer. I stopped using them and went to the Wasp's for one main reason, tunability and two lessor reasons of cost and convince. The Wasp SST Boss BH's were advertised as requiring almost no tuning to get to fly to the same POI as field points. I bought a pack and gave them a try. Sure enough they flew so close to my field points POI that I did not have to adjust my sight to hunt with them. That also allowed me to save over $60 a year in destroying BH's while practicing with them, and it freed me of having to change my sights from FP's to BH,s POI every season.

But I would still give the Nap T-heads high marks for being excellent deer killing BH's.
I have so far killed five deer with the Wasp SST Boss BH's and have been 1000% satisfied with their performance on all levels.


At present I use and absolutely love Wasp SST 3 and 4 bladed broad heads for the fallowing reasons:

#1-ACCURACY
They literally fly to the almost exact same POI as my field points with little or no tuning and no change in my set up
#2-DURABILITY
Since I have been using the Wasp SST's while practicing I have accidentally shot them into the steel Unistrut that I use to sandwich my HM foam archery target more times than I care to admit and not once did the Wasp SST BH fail or come apart in any way, did not even loose a single blade. And the damage to the steel unistrut was impressive as the BH tip actually managed to penetrate and make a hole in the steel. I once after seeing a Wasp add where they shot a Wasp fixed blade BH through a metal garbage to can prove it's durability, decided to duplicate that test. Shot the same Wasp BH two times into a steel garbage can at 20 yards. The first hit put the BH through side #1 and almost through side #2 and stayed 100% intact. Shot # two only penetrated one side, with shot #2 stuck into the other side of the GC, still the BH remained 100% intact, although quite disfigured as one would expect. I could not shoot any additional shots as I felt my arrow was damaged to badly to fly at all strait.

I have since taken five deer with the Wasp three bladed SST Boss BH's that have a 1-1/8" cutting diameter. All five were 100% pass throughs and all left blood trails as good as any 1-1/4 cutting diameter BH I ever used. All were DBL lung hits, none went over 75yrds before expiring.

I know countless bow hunters are enjoying success using mechanical BH's these days and in all fairness mechanical BH's have come a loooong way, but at my speeds and with my results on deer I strongly feel a mechanical BH simply does not offer me anything better than my fixed blade BH's do so why change?

No offense meant, but a bow hunter can not go wrong with using a well made fixed blade broad head that flies well. There is a saying I agree with strongly. "Murphy was a bow hunter" Murphy being the originator of "Murphy's Law" and if ever your mechanical BH is going to fail you on game, you can bet your bow it will be on the buck or bull of a life time, because no BH design can make up for a poorly placed shot.

[Harley]

Thank you, Art, for taking the time to write such an extensive review of your experience.

Two things worry me about potential problems with my new G5 fixed blades:

1. My bow is quick - 294 fps. You seem concerned that fixed blades will wind-plane at high speeds, and I've never before owned a bow this fast.

2. I can't tune my broadheads because I've epoxied the inserts into my shafts; I can only hope the 2" Blazer vanes don't set up a conflict with the broadhead.

As I said somewhere, it's not important to me that the fixed blades hit the same POI as my field points; worst case scenario is to tune the bow for them before hunting season. (Actually, the worst case scenario is concern #1, above.)

Anyway, the G5's will be here today and I'll start testing them tomorrow.

Harley

[bloodtrailer]

Muzzy 3 blade 100s and I tune them by putting on the head then fletching (w/2 in blazers )them to aline with the blades numbering arrow shaft and head. Art back in the day I used Rocky mnt Ultras 1 1/2 in fixed blade, like a flying sword. I had to tune everything and use 5in feathers What a HOLE they put threw a deer.
Talk about PETA c
Animal Rights Activists protested Leather-wearing at a biker rally.
HERE'S HOW POLICE FOUND ONE OF THEM.

Johnstown, PA (GlossyNews) - Local and state police scoured the hills outside rural Johnstown, Pennsylvania, after reports of three animal rights activists going missing after attempting to protest the wearing of leather at a large motorcycle gang rally this weekend. Two others, previously reported missing, were discovered by fast food workers "duct taped inside several fast food restaurant dumpsters," according to police officials.
"Something just went wrong," said a still visibly shaken organizer of the protest. "Something just went horribly, horribly, wrong." The organizer said a group of concerned animal rights activist groups, "growing tired of throwing fake blood and shouting profanities at older women wearing leather or fur coats," decided to protest the annual motorcycle club event "in a hope to show them our outrage at their wanton use of leather in their clothing and motor bike seats." "In fact," said the organizer, "motorcycle gangs are one of the biggest abusers of wearing leather, and we decided it was high time that we let them know that we disagree with them using it.ergo, they should stop."
According to witnesses, protesters arrived at the event in a vintage 1960's era Volkswagen van and began to pelt the gang members with balloons filled with red colored water, simulating blood, and shouting "you're murderers" to passers by. This, evidently, is when the brouhaha began.
"They peed on me!!!" charged one activist. "They grabbed me, said I looked like I was French, started calling me 'La Trene', and duct taped me to a tree so they could pee on me all day!"
Still others claimed they were forced to eat hamburgers and hot dogs under duress. Those who resisted were allegedly held down while several bikers "farted on their heads."
Police officials declined comments on any leads or arrests due to the ongoing nature of the investigation; however, organizers for the motorcycle club rally expressed "surprise" at the allegations.
"That's preposterous," said one high-ranking member of the biker organizing committee. "We were having a party, and these people showed up and were very rude to us. They threw things at us, called us names, and tried to ruin the entire event. So, what did we do? We invited them to the party! What could be more friendly than that? You know, just because we are all members of motorcycle clubs does not mean we do not care about inclusiveness. Personally, I think it shows a lack of character for them to be saying such nasty things about us after we bent over backwards to make them feel welcome."
When confronted with the allegations of force-feeding the activists meat, using them as ad hoc latrines, leaving them incapacitated in fast food restaurant dumpsters, and 'farting on their heads,' the organizer declined to comment in detail. "That's just our secret handshake," assured the organizer.








heck this out

[Harley]

I recently read, and tend to believe, that there should be no need to "tune" broadheads; that they require no more than being absolutely aligned and symmetrical. Given that, they should hit POI where the field points hit.

I would add two observations, though:

1. Very few broadheads (I'd vote for the G5) are that well centered.
2. There's always the chance that your broadhead may require more steering than your present fletching provides.

What do you think?

Harley

[deadeye]

harley,im gonna disagree a tiny bit about what your reading about no need to tune a broadhead,here is why-any time you change weight distributation meaning some have heavier blades,wider cutting paths,different shank weights/length's & such-possibly altering the spine/imo. after weighing some vary above a weighed field point& some less. in my finding's the tuning adjustment is very small but to add to my point when you add a quiver to the bow w/approx 3,000 gn's of sideweight it has altered my final set-up to get perfect broadhead bulletholes if im doing my job on not torquing(but my quiver is ;D.) it would like be adding 3,000 gn's of sideweight to a rifle &expect the same & we both know it makes a small bit of difference sometimes. having said this i have been shooting muzzy since they came out giving up razorback 5's & thunderheads in which the muzzy at that time(pro-shop years)was much more accurate(broadhead) & had no need to look elsewhere for broadhead performance but im sure many do as well today. but still final tune the broadhead for hunting performance/imo

[Harley]

I dunno, Deadeye; I perfectly agree about the quiver's making a difference. I've always tuned my setup without a quiver and always remove the quiver once I'm in my stand.

But, you are not changing weight distribution by switching from a field point to a broadhead IF (big IF) the broadhead is both symmetrical with regard to its blades and centered with regard to the shaft. For instance, 100 grains is 100 grains, whether it's field point or broadhead, and the FOC is not changed when you replace the field point with the same weight broadhead. (I just did that experiment.)

I'm not arguing that most people won'tl have to tune their broadheads, but it's because their broadheads don't meet the specifications I've set up.

I thought I'd just gotten lucky that my G5's hit exactly where my field points hit, but then realized it's due to the superior craftmanship of the G5, not luck.

We can agree to disagree on this

Harley

[deadeye]

harley,im very glad you got the g-5;s to shoot & i may try myself& they might be superior balanced. im very interested in the broadhead sharpener also. im very poor on trying to explain things . my point is broadheads differ in contruction & weight is not always equal from one brand to the other,some have trocar-tips i suspect weigh less on the tip than others, if more threaded shank weight was in the insert i could see small difference of spine imo,i only know after years & thousands of paper test there are some difference from broadhead paper tuning from field points for whatever reason,there's no friction just good conversation imo

[boarhog]

I have never tried a mechanical broadhead. Heard too many stories about how they failed. I have no idea how many deer and hogs I killed with the old Bear Razorhead, mostly without the razor insert, and never had a failure to penetrate. Started out with an old Bear Kodiak Deluxe recurve, then an Allen compound, then a Pearson Z-Bow, and then back to basics with an Old Ben Longbow. I know those old Razorheads were heavy, as were the Herters aluminum arrows, and I have no idea how fast they were going, but I have shot a near 300 lb hog almost end to end. Now, because of rusty shoulders, I am forced to use a crossbow, so I have tried a few more modern broadheads, still no mechanicals. Wasp, Satillite, Razorback 5, and a few others with mostly mediocre performance. This year, I think I'll use the Montec or Muzzy, depending on which shoots best for me.

[dougedwards]

I think that the only reason that some archers prefer mechanicals is because they can't get the fixed heads to group sufficiently. However mechanicals have come a long way in the last couple of years and most of them are very dependable at opening up on impact. The problem that I had with Rage broadheads is that they would open up prior to impact but I do believe that Rage has that problem solved now.

Doug

[Harley]

Deadeye, I haven't compared paper tuning of broadheads and field points; maybe that would have revealed some difference; but, at 20 yards there is absolutely no difference in grouping or POI for me. Of course, that's not really scientific because I'm introducing my own level of inadequacy; however, for practical purposes there's no need for me to make any adjustments between the two points.

Now, I just have to move past 20 yards; rain is forecast, but I'd like to take my portable target to a field and have at it.

Boarhog, you're taking me back, way back. I was the Bear Archery dealer for the southern part of my state in the early 1960's and was able to shoot all those old bows and use any of the accessories I liked. Fred Bear took a small interest in me because we were both left handed; he used to send me sample bows for my own use, and loaned me copies of all his hunting tapes to show at the local Kiwanis weekly meetings.

Yesterday, I compared the Muzzy and the Montec CS in blister packs at BassPro; visually, at least, the G5's win hands down. They also look sturdier and I'd guess would be more likely to penetrate if you hit your deer on an angle shot. I don't remember, but I think the G5 costs more. Hope you'll report on your choice.

Harley

[bloodtrailer]

Remember very few broad heads will tune to the same point of impact due to there longer profile , :Oby lengthening the arrow you change the front of center balance that's why sanders came out with longer practice points. Also you MUST have the fletching control the flight ,NOT the broad head ! There must be some degree of spin to your fletching, I use a Helical left even with my 2in blazers. When the WINGS up front start to steer , things go bad. Those who don't tune favor low or no profile heads (mechanical : anything mechanical is subject to fail) that's why the K.I.S.S. ;D is the best rule. An arrow coming out of the bow centered, and correct spine goes along way in good flight. Having all your arrows as identical as possible cuts down on variables, (spin test all broad heads don't trust that they are new, a slight degree off to one side can spell trouble) and then we come to your form and fallow through . A good drop away rest, a center shot arrow and lastly, tune your broad heads and practice with what you HUNT WITH. Just as with the Savage , bullets and broad heads are cheep, compared with that deer of a life time , When he walks into range you want to KNOW to the inch the impact and exit points.(Know your max Range and stick to it!)
Harley : the more of your post I read the more respect I have gained for your life time of acquired wisdom. You truly are an asset to this forum!

[deadeye]

harley,you were a lucky man to have involvement with the late fred bear, i still have our archery dealer plaque signed by fred as we were a dealer in the 90's for bear archery(purchased a existing archery shop that opened in the 70's),i miss the fred bear museum in gainesville also.

[Harley]

Bloodtrailer, as a long time married man I'm not used to endorsements, so I'm copying your comment to my wife. Thanks.

Re: My reply #15 above, about FOC:

I've discovered that there are different ways to compute FOC and different measurements to be used in those computations, none of them better than any other if you regard them as measures of relative performance between components. The one I assumed in reply #15 showed no difference in FOC between field points and the fixed blade Montec CS, with an FOC of 14.3%. The main measurement influencing that result was assuming the total arrow length to be from the nock pocket to the end of the shaft behind the insert.

Today I used a different formula which utilizes a total arrow length from the nock pocket to the actual tip of the point. With the Montec CS the FOC was 10.9%; with the field tip the FOC was 12.4%. I think the reason the field tip has a higher FOC is because it has more weight concentrated in the very end of the tip than the raked back broadhead.

Since Easton regards 7-15% FOC as acceptable I'm satisfied that I'm in the ballpark.

I doubt that the 1.4% difference in FOC between my broadhead and field point will result in any significantly measureable difference on target AT ANY RANGE.

Of much more concern to me is one of the points bloodtrailer made about whether or not the relatively small, slightly offset 2" Blazers will be able to steer the broadhead at longer ranges to the target. I'm thinking that "tuning"; i.e., aligning the blades with the vanes is not the answer, although it can't hurt. If the Blazers won't steer the broadhead, maybe I should try either longer and/or taller vanes and/or more helical. I don't want to do anything, of course, both because of the effort involved and the fact that any of the above modifications would slow the arrow.

Deadeye, I wish I had saved some correspondence from Fred Bear, but it never occurred to me back then. Wouldn't it be great if we could know ahead of time what was going to become a "classic"? When I was a small boy my father had a pawn shop and I remember stomping on wooden ammunition boxes and crates to make kindling for the big wood-burning stove; now, those same crates can bring $100 each. My father also gave me a bunch of old Colt cap and ball revolvers to play with (and lose) because they were not shootable. Try to buy one, now.

Harley

[boarhog]

Shortly after I moved to Pine Bluff, Arkansas, I had the good fortune to meet Ben Pearson, and have several memorable conversations with him. I was invited to visit him in his home once, and was wide eyed by his Polar Bear and Grizzly life size, standing mounts! He had just retired at the time, and passed away a couple of years later. We probably have Fred Bear and Ben Pearson to thank for where archery hunting is today. An interesting side note. He gave me a double handful of his Deadhead( he also called them Chopper) heads, in two widths. He swore by them, and sharpened them with a file only! I tried my best to use them, but might as well have been using a Boomerang! Never could get them to stabilize.