|
Post by jims on Apr 4, 2016 19:32:02 GMT -5
That is fine shooting.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2016 19:50:32 GMT -5
Any caliber restrictions on this 25 shot MOA test? Groups to be measured CTC I assume.
|
|
|
Post by Dave W on Apr 4, 2016 20:08:38 GMT -5
this is my last 24 shots out of my 45, no cherry picking Excellent shooting!! Think most people use .458 even for smooth sized so you are probably cheating yourself a little.
|
|
|
Post by Dave W on Apr 4, 2016 20:14:07 GMT -5
Any caliber restrictions on this 25 shot MOA test? Groups to be measured CTC I assume. You don't have time for this stuff, get to work. Like to see all those .416 groups Omega shot and see what they averaged.
|
|
|
Post by deertroy1 on Apr 4, 2016 20:15:52 GMT -5
That is some fantastic shooting buckstuds. Even if my rifle was capable I'd probably muff a shot or two! Excellent trigger control there!
|
|
|
Post by mcgowen45 on Apr 4, 2016 21:26:51 GMT -5
Any caliber restrictions on this 25 shot MOA test? Groups to be measured CTC I assume. 2X on this one.
|
|
|
Post by pposey on Apr 4, 2016 22:33:54 GMT -5
I've shot alot of sabots,, pretty much getting good groups unless I pushed it to hard and blew a sabot, I used to shoot 25 shots before I considered a load "proved" IE sabot safe. This meant not pushing the edge. Knurling helped as well. "1.84" for fifty 3 shot groups." is some darn good shooting There are so many variables with a sabot that consistancy takes attention but is very doable the following target shoes what I mean,,, knurling, different bullets,,, and the preference of the barrel for number of shots before cleaning and how cleaned Target
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 5, 2016 8:17:41 GMT -5
What if you shot the gun clean always ? Also how do you clean your gun ? Knurling helps ? Harvester smooth blue or crushed ? Sorry for all the questions trying to learn . Thanks
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 5, 2016 8:21:45 GMT -5
I have noticed the same thing if I have a sabot that loads hard it will always be out of the group . I don't know if it's the bullet or the sabot. I have been thinking about trying to size my bullets to see if that makes a difference.
|
|
|
Post by buckstuds on Apr 5, 2016 8:53:15 GMT -5
I have a lite weight 45 that shoots sabots well. The gun seems to like the 195 barnes in light blue sabots. My best accuracy came when I knurl the barnes up .002 and run the bullet sabot combo thru my smooth form die. This way every combo is the exact same size. I can keep the combos together if treated gently.
|
|
|
Post by pposey on Apr 5, 2016 11:25:13 GMT -5
What if you shot the gun clean always ? Also how do you clean your gun ? Knurling helps ? Harvester smooth blue or crushed ? Sorry for all the questions trying to learn . Thanks For me a light knurl has helped every load I have shot with a sabot. I use the Harv. smooth blue with 200xtp and barnes 195 Cleaning really depends on the barrel, My encore conversion likes to be cleaned every 10 shots or so. I clean it every 8 if I am worried about accuracy which is about always. I use Hoppes bore cleaner for the "Big" clean every 8 shots, and a clean dry patch between shots to knock the loose fouling from the barrel. It will group 2-3 very well without the dry patch between shots. But the first shot from a squeaky clean bore will be low every time. If you shot every shot through a really clean barrel they should group the same,,, however I had one savage factory .50 cal barrel that would not shoot the first shot through a clean barrel with any accuracy or predictability,, it liked it dirty and I could shoot 20-30 shots without cleaning, not even a dry patch. My pacnor .45 that I bulged was in between. Needed a cleaning every 20 or so to keep groups tight.
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 5, 2016 11:45:56 GMT -5
Thanks I appreciate the info .May I ask your load ?
|
|
|
Post by pposey on Apr 5, 2016 21:48:19 GMT -5
58 grain H4198, harv baby blue, 195 barnes or 200xtp, fed 209A primer,, either bullet slightly knurled to show a diamond pattern
that load hits like a hammer on deer with the barnes, goes all the way through from bow to stern
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 5, 2016 22:28:48 GMT -5
Thanks appreciate it!
|
|
|
Post by jims on Apr 6, 2016 11:39:30 GMT -5
I shoot a load with mild recoil. 10 grains of 4759 and 50 grains of 4198. Fine accuracy with the bullets mentioned above and primers and sabot and mild recoil although the ML is heavier than stock. This is out of a .45 barrel, also knurl as pposey does.
|
|
|
Post by buckstuds on Apr 6, 2016 11:49:15 GMT -5
The 10/50 load chronos at 2770fps out of my 25 inch barrel.
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 6, 2016 13:48:41 GMT -5
Lol that's still very fast with low recoil ! Inch groups? Or will it do better ?
|
|
|
Post by buckstuds on Apr 6, 2016 14:57:35 GMT -5
3/4 inch at 100 with sabots is a deer killing machine.Recoil is like a 243.
|
|
|
Post by spc136 on Apr 6, 2016 21:44:17 GMT -5
Thats great !
|
|
|
Post by jims on Apr 7, 2016 8:25:46 GMT -5
My load combo certainly recoils more than a .243 but is more than tolerable. Both my daughters did not find the recoil objectionable and one is recoil conscious. Foot pounds of recoil I do not know.
|
|
|
Post by mcgowen45 on Apr 7, 2016 19:45:33 GMT -5
I've found the same thing some of you have. Most of the groups posted are cherry picked and not consistent long term groups. I'd be willing to bet some $$ against someone shooting a 25 shot group under 1 inch at 100 yards. All 25 count. No "flyer" crap and "wind got that one." A single bullet outside the 1 inch mark and game is over. I doubt I'd lose much money. On the other hand I'd not take the bet for 2 inches at 100 yards and when you are honest a 25 shot group at 100 yards under 2 inches with a muzzle loader is d**n fine results. Don Still waiting on a answer to whether there is a caliber restriction on this, and whether the groups will be measured CTC by a unbiased individual.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2016 22:26:28 GMT -5
I've found the same thing some of you have. Most of the groups posted are cherry picked and not consistent long term groups. I'd be willing to bet some $$ against someone shooting a 25 shot group under 1 inch at 100 yards. All 25 count. No "flyer" crap and "wind got that one." A single bullet outside the 1 inch mark and game is over. I doubt I'd lose much money. On the other hand I'd not take the bet for 2 inches at 100 yards and when you are honest a 25 shot group at 100 yards under 2 inches with a muzzle loader is d**n fine results. Don Still waiting on a answer to whether there is a caliber restriction on this, and whether the groups will be measured CTC by a unbiased individual. One way to do this is use the bullseye unit and record the shoot.
|
|
|
Post by deertroy1 on Apr 9, 2016 15:11:30 GMT -5
Well, a week has gone by so I thought I'd try the 40gr load from last week to see if my group was a fluke. It was a bit warmer today with temps around 45F. I didn't do as good last week but I'm pleased. My first two shots hit within a half inch of each other with the final shot opening the group up to 1.25". I only allow enough time between shots to walk up to the target and back. About 5 minutes by the time I load. I actually had a load of 41gr but decided this 40gr load is good enough for my purposes which is whitetails inside of 150 yards considering my results from last weekend. I'd like to fire another group or two at subzero temperatures but that may have to wait until next year. Although maybe not as a few days ago it was only about 10F.
|
|
|
Post by jims on Apr 9, 2016 16:46:10 GMT -5
Nice shooting, even with cool temps I have seen similar third sabot shots, enough heat to make it not quite as close on the third one.
|
|
|
Post by donw28 on Apr 10, 2016 12:22:49 GMT -5
I've found the same thing some of you have. Most of the groups posted are cherry picked and not consistent long term groups. I'd be willing to bet some $$ against someone shooting a 25 shot group under 1 inch at 100 yards. All 25 count. No "flyer" crap and "wind got that one." A single bullet outside the 1 inch mark and game is over. I doubt I'd lose much money. On the other hand I'd not take the bet for 2 inches at 100 yards and when you are honest a 25 shot group at 100 yards under 2 inches with a muzzle loader is d**n fine results. Don Still waiting on a answer to whether there is a caliber restriction on this, and whether the groups will be measured CTC by a unbiased individual. Since the majority post .45 then lets say .45. And to make it interesting, then I'd say $1000 ought to be sufficient to make it sporting and worth my time. I'm not adverse to going higher as long as the $$ are held by a 3rd party. Remember the stipulation. 1 single round out of 25 that pushed the group outside 1 inch ctc and you lose. I'd have gotten back sooner but I'm working OCONUS and don't return to the U.S. for another week. Don
|
|
|
Post by donw28 on Apr 10, 2016 13:15:47 GMT -5
Still waiting on a answer to whether there is a caliber restriction on this, and whether the groups will be measured CTC by a unbiased individual. Since the majority post .45 then lets say .45. And to make it interesting, then I'd say $1000 ought to be sufficient to make it sporting and worth my time. I'm not adverse to going higher as long as the $$ are held by a 3rd party. Remember the stipulation. 1 single round out of 25 that pushed the group outside 1 inch ctc and you lose. I'd have gotten back sooner but I'm working OCONUS and don't return to the U.S. for another week. Don By the way--I'm not looking to question anyone's honesty regarding their shooting or rifle. I think guys get on here, as the original poster did, looking for validation that their rifle is OK. And I think an aggregate of 150 rounds at 1.84 inches is exceptional shooting for a muzzle loader. But I stand by my contention that very very few muzzle loaders and shooters will consistently shoot under 1 inch at 100 yards. Too much involved in that for it to happen unless it is a fluke or you are 1) a world class shooter and 2) you have that exceptional once in a 100 rifle. Just the time to fire 25 rounds from a muzzle loader is likely to cause an issue(and I'm assuming sabotless in this deal) because you either have barrel heat if you shoot as rapidly as you can reload or if you space them out then atmospheric conditions are likely to change. Throw in a tad of inconsistent loading pressure, having to pick the gun up each time to reload, some nerves if you have a $1000 on the line :-), primers that aren't exactly match grade, etc. and you end up shooting a measly 25 shot group at 1.4 inches perhaps because of just a couple rounds. Gee- isn't that just poor shooting. What it is really is fantastic. What it is not is that 3 round .364 group that all of us love to post. Then someone gets on here and says they measure their last 20 5 shot groups and they measured 2.13 inches and why isn't their rifle shooting "right" or wondering if they need to keep spending money or time to find a correct load for those .5 inch groups. These are hunting rifles to most guys and should be measured as such. Don
|
|
|
Post by deertroy1 on Apr 10, 2016 13:21:11 GMT -5
These are hunting rifles to most guys and should be measured as such. Don I could not agree more!
|
|
|
Post by ourway77 on Apr 10, 2016 16:19:10 GMT -5
Great shooting I wish I could do as well. As for posting the best groups you don't want to see my bad ones, and when I do get a good group I want to show it off. LOL
|
|
|
Post by deertroy1 on Apr 10, 2016 17:26:59 GMT -5
Great shooting I wish I could do as well. As for posting the best groups you don't want to see my bad ones, and when I do get a good group I want to show it off. LOL I sure can't fault you for that!
|
|
|
Post by Earnhardt on Apr 10, 2016 17:48:26 GMT -5
Since the majority post .45 then lets say .45. And to make it interesting, then I'd say $1000 ought to be sufficient to make it sporting and worth my time. I'm not adverse to going higher as long as the $$ are held by a 3rd party. Remember the stipulation. 1 single round out of 25 that pushed the group outside 1 inch ctc and you lose. I'd have gotten back sooner but I'm working OCONUS and don't return to the U.S. for another week. Don By the way--I'm not looking to question anyone's honesty regarding their shooting or rifle. I think guys get on here, as the original poster did, looking for validation that their rifle is OK. And I think an aggregate of 150 rounds at 1.84 inches is exceptional shooting for a muzzle loader. But I stand by my contention that very very few muzzle loaders and shooters will consistently shoot under 1 inch at 100 yards. Too much involved in that for it to happen unless it is a fluke or you are 1) a world class shooter and 2) you have that exceptional once in a 100 rifle. Just the time to fire 25 rounds from a muzzle loader is likely to cause an issue(and I'm assuming sabotless in this deal) because you either have barrel heat if you shoot as rapidly as you can reload or if you space them out then atmospheric conditions are likely to change. Throw in a tad of inconsistent loading pressure, having to pick the gun up each time to reload, some nerves if you have a $1000 on the line :-), primers that aren't exactly match grade, etc. and you end up shooting a measly 25 shot group at 1.4 inches perhaps because of just a couple rounds. Gee- isn't that just poor shooting. What it is really is fantastic. What it is not is that 3 round .364 group that all of us love to post. Then someone gets on here and says they measure their last 20 5 shot groups and they measured 2.13 inches and why isn't their rifle shooting "right" or wondering if they need to keep spending money or time to find a correct load for those .5 inch groups. These are hunting rifles to most guys and should be measured as such. Don Really!? This is the best joke I've read in a long time. Do you write your own material? Thank you for enlightening us. We are honored.
|
|