2nd run with Triumph

[davewolf]

Shot today at 100-yards only, using SBH's--250-grain Shockwaves and 100-grains of BH209. Well that should of been the ticket, but no it wasn't.
First shot went low and far right--couldn't even find it on the paper. The two following shots went low and to the right, but they grouped less than 2-inches.
Time for scope adjustment. So I tracked the target,so to speak as each shot moved an inch or two to the left and then higher. One over-adjustment on my part, took it left of bull. I over adjusted the scope on purpose to see if it would shoot 2-inches high at 100. It did but my right clicks didn't seem to take.

My first two sessions leave me some impressions and more questions.
1. My Triumph isn't heads above the Pro-Pursuit--although I think it has the potential to be.
2. BH209 does allow easy clean-up, but am still wondering if Pyrodex pellets would do a good job for less.
3. Shockwaves improved my Traditions, using Pyrodex by 90-percent.
4. The SHS's? I can't offer much of an opinion, just yet, because I shot only these today. They seated every shot, well about the same as the longer sabots. I'm sure I order some.
Questions:
1. The heat, it was 94 in the shade here today, read (on other threads) that it does make a difference?
2. Dry swabbing, no swabbing or wet followed by dry patches?
(I dry swabbed between each shot this time.)
3. 100-grains? BH 209, should I be using less or more?
4. My shockwave 250's? Work great in the Traditions, and shot lights out groups at 25-yards...but will listen to suggestions.
Check the Triumph debut thread if you missed the first outing.
Thanks, found some hot dogs and baked beans to eat! Yippee.
Hope to back to the range on Tuesday, so any and all suggestions are appreciated, as always.
Have a great day!
Dave

[younghunter86]

94* is pretty darn hot! That could have been a large part of the problem. I would say to try it another day when temps are a little cooler. You could try to up the charge by 10 grains and see what happens.

If you don't mind swabbing between shots you could go back to T7. I think it would probably be beneficial if you would use loose T7 versus the pellets. Plus the loose is chaper.

[mshm99]

94 degrees = barrel cooler. From what I have measured(and that's not a lot) the hi-lo spread on velocity is way less on BH209 (that's a good thing). Plastic fouling can make a normally accurate barrel spit rounds all over the place. After the dry patch, run a brush down the bore several times and then look. Plastic will raise whiskers.

mshm

mshm

[Boonechaser]

I would go to 110gr. bh209 and try agian. That seems to be where most of the TC's tend to be most accurate.
I do not swab between shots and have had no issues, and loads easier on a fouled barrel. Temp could be an issue make sure you let your barrel cool between shots (may help)

[artjr338wm]

I would also have to agree that any bad results you get while shooting in 94* heat, especially if it is the first time ever you try out a load or powder or any component, should be treated as questionable at best.

To be perfectly honest my past experience has been almost 90% disappointingly inconsistent when shooting a ML in temps much above 75*. But I tend to always shoot max loads out of my MLs.

Bottom line is high temps above 80* are he!! on sabots.

I would definitely try again in temps below 80* or as close to 55-60* if at all possible for this time of year wear you live.

Now you know why members of this site so strongly praise going sabot-less once they have done so.

Some where here is a post with pictures of two 300 yrd sub-2" 3-shot groups fired sabot-less in I think in 94-95* temps. But that was also IIRC a 40 cal ML.

[robnj]

+1 to what Art said.

I was determined to shoot today (temp was 85*). Complete waste of time. I fired 2 shots with my base load..... and got a 4" spread at 50 yds. I put the gun away and cut my losses.

At least 1 more day with this heat wave.

[davewolf]

Thanks folks,
As always I appreciate each and every comment and suggestion and soak them up like a sponge. Believe me, I haven't given-up on any of the components I used yesterday and If you look at my first outing with the Triumph, you will see that I didn't get on paper the first time out at 100.

I really didn't enjoy shooting in that kind of heat, as much as I usually enjoy shooting....and since I live in PA, it better not stay this hot from now throughout the summer. I did allow the barrel to cool down between each shot and my concentration may have drifted toward the end, Remember I just plop down a Caldwell bag for a front rest...nothing else.

I want this to be a hunting gun and want to take a groundhog with it this summer, and hunt more with it in the fall.
I've heard that in whatever weather you shoot in cold or hot, you need to sight it your rifle in that clime. Have you guys heard the same?

After rereading my threads on the Pro-Pursuit I realized that it took me over two-months of shooting once a week to get her where she was when I sold her. Tony had planned to join me, but was recovering from his pin being removed from his ankle--he might have came along anyway, but his wife reined him in!

Because he's shooting the same loads,--powder & bullets, with a Pro-Hunter Scope vs my Omega it would have been interesting to compare one to another. But, I love this gun and am as determined to get it right as I was the Traditions Pro-Pursuit.

I just want to reach a confident level with it=that to me equals confidence. Any other suggestions? I swear I'm going to take a photo of all this stuff I've accumulated in less than three-months.

So would you agree, try her in the same manner, in cooler weather?
Thanks, I appreciate every bit of advice!
Have a great day!
Dave

[younghunter86]

Here is what I would do:

Use 110 grains BH209 with supplied sabot and the 250 grain shockwave and then do everything the same except switch to the harvester short black. Fire two, three shot groups with each combination. Do this without swabbing, it will be tight, but a tight fit is good. If it's going to be 80*, try to get out early in the morning, when it's still cool. Also, don't get worried about the groups. As long as you're having fun and can get more components, things are good.

[whyohe]

i will go along with every one else.

1) go up 10 grns of BH209

2) try shooting as early in the morning as possible

3) yes you should shoot in the temps you plan on shooting it BUT get it to shoot accuratly first. heat is rough on sabots so get it to shoot accuratly in the cooler weather(or cooler mornings). then as it gets warmer shoot it to see what happens, then you can see what the heat does to your groups.

[tpcollins]

I've seen people at the range shoot-load-shoot-load and complain about their accuracy. I'd try to tell them their barrel could be a tad hot from the rapid firing and might be melting/distorting the sabot because the barrel hasn't cooled down enough. They'd look at me kinda funny and keep shooting all over the place. I would think 94 degrees kinda exasterbates the issue.

[davewolf]

Tough decision, but I decided not to shoot today. It's already steaming hot here. Not an easy decision because I really want to get back out there.

On the barrel heating up issue, it took me over 2 1/2 hours to shoot 9-shots--so in this case I've ruled that one out. But do appreciate the observation.

Will be measuring some BH209 at 110-grains and have some left over in vials measured at 100, so I hope to get out there soon as my work schedule allows. The cool down in PA is supposed to start tomorrow.

I wanted to add that I was shooting CCI M's. If anyone thinks that might make a difference. Since I'm delaying my next run any and all observations or suggestions are appreciated.
Thanks again!
Have a great day!
Dave

[minst7877]

Yesterday it was 85 here in Michigan and today the high was at midnight and is expected to get no warmer that the low 50's Only 48 degrees and rain at 11:30am. This is headed your way.

DC

[whyohe]

dave i dont mean to beat a dead horse but in 94 degree heat it can take more than 15 minutes to cool the barrel. you waited just over 15 minutes between shots which is good in 60 degree weather. you will find that the sabots if left in your car on a sunny day with heat like that can get soft by themselves. i still think heat is one issue. glad it is beginning to cool here though so you can get some shooting in!