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Post by madcityhoosier on Dec 4, 2013 13:24:55 GMT -5
Congrats on the nice deer. However, considering so many of us are using custom SML's, it should be mandatory that the kill photos include the rifle as well!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2013 14:49:42 GMT -5
Lots O' mass! Congrats!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2013 18:58:29 GMT -5
Nice buck. Congrats.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2013 19:05:15 GMT -5
It's been a so so week for me, a little slower than normal and definitely less deer. I've seen around 10 or 11 bucks total so far (mostly young eight pointers and a few scrubs), still waiting to pull the trigger. Did have to pass the nice eight point this morning that Dave and I both passed earlier in bow season, talk about gritting your teeth. Tough watching a 140 class buck walk away when you're having a slow week. It's starting to look like a tag soup year, I hope the action picks up.
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Post by jims on Dec 4, 2013 20:03:24 GMT -5
Skunked today-almost. I had mentioned yesterday that I saw a couple of small bucks and about a dozen does and yearlings yesterday in the afternoon. That was from a permanent stand I built three years ago but never hunted out of before. I know the question about that except I have a really tried and true stand that has been used for 15 years and really saw no reason to switch. Anyways was in well before dawn and sat there all day and saw no deer- until 5 minutes before sunset. I ended up seeing a small buck, about a 120 buck and I continued to "watch" it as well as I could until more than 30 minutes after sunset (end of shooting time). I saw a much larger bodied deer approach it. I could tell it was much bigger than the 120 but at the distance and the time and background I could not say anything for sure other than it was substantially bigger bodied for whatever that is worth. It appears the new stand is good at late hours but I will go to my old stand for the AM and return to it at night. It is big enough for my daughter to be in it also but she generally likes the AM hunts but we may switch that next year. Good hunting to all the Ohio hunters. Mid week things slow down, I only heard 5 shots all day. Sat and Sunday will pick up again I would imagine.
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Post by Dave W on Dec 4, 2013 20:41:45 GMT -5
Great looking, heavy, buck!
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Post by jims on Dec 4, 2013 21:06:11 GMT -5
Very nice deer.
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Post by wirtbowhunter on Dec 4, 2013 22:53:16 GMT -5
I forgot to mention the most amazing thing about Monday, as we were dragging my buck out of the woods, I ran into one of my hunting buddies that had just shot a pretty nice buck. He took a look at my buck and told me that a few minutes before he saw us that he tripped on something. He looked down and it was a shed from last year. He was pretty certain that the shed that he picked up was off of the buck I had just shot. I couldn't believe it, what are the odds of finding a shed from 10 months ago on the day that the buck was killed. Crazy really, but it is without a doubt the shed off of my buck, it has the same forked brow tine and the same characteristics. He put on a little tine length and a bunch of mass in the last year. My son had to help holding the shed up for one of the pictures.
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Post by jims on Dec 5, 2013 4:40:30 GMT -5
That gives hope to those that have the ability to let a nice deer pass by. The next year they will be even better as is yours.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 5:11:33 GMT -5
Those are some great pics. Congrats again on a fine deer and glad to see the little one involved, that's great.
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Post by jims on Dec 5, 2013 20:37:49 GMT -5
I saw 12 does/yearlings and 3 bucks today. One shootable buck but after 530PM and even with an illuminated Weaver Classic Extreme it was too dark for a shot. Better next year as they say. I hope all the Ohio deer hunters have had a successful hunt to date and good times with the hunting companions.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2013 21:22:52 GMT -5
Looking like tag soup for me this year, but it was by choice so I can't complain too much. Think I saw a total of 15 bucks all week, not terrible but not up to normal stats either. Passed up some pretty good bucks, hopefully they will be around for next year. May sneak back out with a bow a time or two yet if the weather permits. Hope everyone had "an enjoyable season" to this point.
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Post by jims on Dec 8, 2013 21:37:46 GMT -5
I just got back in also. I had a wife with the flu and I wanted to stay with her but she encouraged me to go out this PM. Saw 10, all does and yearlings. Overall about 50 deer observed this week, of course I am sure some of those are repeats. Saw about 6 different bucks, that is actually alot for me but the overall count is not. Two days of ML season in early Jan so I hope to try again. There is a nationally advertised deer outfitter not to far from me. Plants large food tracks etc. A bit hard to compete but I still have it pretty good overall. We ended up with 2 does and 3 yearlings taken overall on the farm. Plenty of meat to give to friends.
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lundy
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Post by lundy on Dec 9, 2013 8:05:57 GMT -5
I have been seeing a steady decline in the deer population where I hunt for many years.
I am not 100% sure what to attribute the reduction to. The coyote population is way up and I am seeing a lot of mature does with no young. The neighbors run 25-30 man drives multiple times on the adjoining properties and kill a bunch of deer but they have been doing that for the entire 25 years I have hunted this property. We sure haven't killed them all, we kill 3-5 deer per year on 700 acres.
The way we manage this property I grew accustomed to seeing (I can see long distances) 25-40 deer per day. The last few years that has now dropped to less than 10 per day. I haven't forgotten how to hunt, the property hasn't changed, the deer haven't changed their locations or travel routes, they just aren't there.
They numbers just aren't there today like the were just a few years ago. This is clearly evidenced by my observations, the declining state harvest numbers, the reduction in deer car accidents and reduced farmer deer damage complaints. I know there is not even distribution, some areas still remain with high populations while other areas have realized a pretty drastic decline.
I think many arrive at an emotional conclusion that the ODNR sucks at deer management, I think it is a much more of a complex problem than that with no single simple answer, I just don't know for sure what the answers are.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2013 8:51:58 GMT -5
We are in the same boat Lundy, except we only have around 110 acres to hunt. The count has been declining for years and the buck to doe ratio is all out of whack, especially on the mature buck side of the equation. We shoot mature bucks only, 140+ and no doe's, the neighboring farms always take care of the doe population so we don't feel the need to shoot any on out small farm. EHD I believe was one big factor, but I have many more beliefs on what the contributing issues are, but this isn't the place for a blundering rant, for it would do no good anyways. 2 or 3 years ago I sent a few "friendly" but "aggressively opinionated" emails to the ODNR, about my concerns about the way the deer management and population was headed, I sent enough until I finally got the reply : " We are educated and trained to do our jobs, we will do as we see fit". Something to that effect. I simply replied, Well you all better take a look at West Virginia, cause that's where we are headed but with much less deer. IMO, some changes have to happen...I could go on forever and I'm sure OH isn't the only state with issues, sounds like IL has some as well. Wisconsin and Pennsylvania made it happen, why can't other states? Answer: They would loose too much (tag) money.
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lundy
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Post by lundy on Dec 9, 2013 9:22:42 GMT -5
Ohioguy,
I got to speak with Mike T, ODNR head of the deer program this past Saturday for a few minutes. He was at the deer processor we use in Athens county aging deer.
We didn't have an opportunity for a lengthy discussion but I did share my concerns about the declining deer population. He was somewhat skeptical saying the harvest in Athens County has remained fairly flat over the years. I tried to express that that, while true, is not representative of the actual live deer population. You can't determine how many live deer exist by counting the dead deer.
I also mentioned that I was seeing a lot of mature does with no young. He did say they have a potential concern with the number of does that appear to not be getting pregnant for some reason.
Anyway he was a nice guy that is a tough situation but no matter how much education and data he has it does not change the reality of what I am seeing first hand. I have been on this same property in excess of 25 years. I have 7 permanent blinds, we run 8-9 cameras, we hunt daylight to dark every single day of the gun season, we have logs for each stand for years. We also try to only shoot mature bucks with the exception of my DIL or new hunters have the green light on almost any deer. It used to be that come the end of the MZ season if we didn't have a good buck by then that we would all (just 3) take a doe for meat. We stopped that practice two years ago. Now the little 4's and 6's are the primary meat targets in late season, We have more little bucks than we do the does. The does get a pass until the population rebounds. Do any of our efforts make a difference? Probably not but we are doing it anyway.
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Post by 247deer on Dec 9, 2013 11:22:22 GMT -5
I bought land in Vinton county last year have had trail cams out for the last couple months have had some good bucks on camera and a lot of little bucks but very few does. but 99% of all deer movement has bin after dark only 1 shooter buck 1 day in daylight photo and my neighbor killed 0ne shooter tue of gun
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2013 14:04:05 GMT -5
Looking at the ODNR website. The total harvest for the county I live in, down 33%. Looking at the county I hunt in, down 40%. HMMM (and down significantly throughout most of the state) Part of this I would have to think is this new game checking system...(Which is ridiculous IMO)As I said above, IMO, some changes have to happen. That's just me thinking out loud.
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Post by Dave W on Dec 9, 2013 18:31:04 GMT -5
I have to question, are the does not getting bred or are the coyotes killing off the fawns? Yotes may not take down healthy full grown deer on a regular basis but fawns I have to believe would be much easier prey. How long will a doe fight to save her fawns against a pack before her survival instincts kick in and she flees?
IMO they need to go back to a 2 tag limit, we are not seeing any where near the numbers of deer we saw in the past. Talked to a friend last night and his crew had a couple days where multiple guys saw no deer for the entire day, unheard of for those guys. Between two EHD outbreaks in the last several years, one being very severe, and the explosion of coyotes in our area, coupled with multiple tags and hunters taking full advantage of said tags. It is no wonder we are seeing fewer deer.
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Post by hunter on Dec 9, 2013 18:52:04 GMT -5
Washington co. and I believe Monroe co. went back to a 2 deer limit this year, with one antlerless tag that had to be used before gun season. Most surrounding counties are still 3 deer. I think I only saw 5 fawns this whole week, 60+% of sighting was small bucks. Last year was the same way.
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Post by mrbuck on Dec 9, 2013 18:59:27 GMT -5
I know the coyotes are taking many fawns in NJ . Remember a doe separates her fawns at birth moving them from the area with the smell of the afterbith , etc . Often the doe can be more than 100 yards away . A coyote could have a fawn and be gone before a doe could defend the fawn . In the suburban areas I have seen a trend over the past few years of fawns being dropped in backyards of houses when more suitable cover was close by . Was this done to place the fawn away from the coyotes ? If there are less deer to start with because of EHD maybe the the increasing numbers of coyotes are even more effective reducing the survival rate of the springs crop of fawns . And don't forget the coyotes are paired up and feeding their 3 to 6 pups !
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Post by fishhawk on Dec 9, 2013 21:03:11 GMT -5
When I started bow hunting late Oct. in Adams Co, I first noticed the lack of sign (rubs, scrapes) in the area of the 220 acres I hunt most often. Seen very few deer but gobs of turkeys. There are a bunch of yotes around, realized when a neighbor set off a car alarm. It sounded like a dozen in a pack started howling. In walking the field edges, all the typical places that have branches overhanging the dirt have no scrapes. Everything tells me less deer until the Sunday night before gun season. I walked out of the field I was hunting into the adjacent field and 15 to 20 dark forms of deer were running off. Either less deer, or wrong place wrong time. Now I didn't hunt a couple weekends due to high winds, but I never had any deer in bow range in 7 or 8 sits.
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Post by jims on Dec 9, 2013 21:42:40 GMT -5
On the land we hunt typically the doe/yearling count is 8 to 10 to 1 over bucks. That is even with trying to harvest all females except for quality bucks. This year our group got 2 does and 3 yearling (females) and no bucks. I know we have coyotes as I see their tracks but generally only see a coyote about every 3 to 5 years during deer season. They have knocked the foxes, I used to see a fox every season but have not seen one in nearly 10 years now. I talked with a Wildlife Officer. He said the size of the bucks taken this year was well above average. I saw two at the meat processor that were really solid. Just my observations. The numbers taken in my county were down but I do not know if that is because more hunters head south, less hunters, higher costs or what. I do not know if they determine how many we can shoot next year based on this year's kill or some actual "count" or what. If the kill is higher do they feel there is more deer so the amount is raised next year or do they cut it because of the harvest amount. I do not know the anwer to that. I do know that until this year in my county unless I took a doe early in the bow season I was limited to 1 deer in gun season. This year I could take 3 but no more than one buck. Quite a change.
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Post by rossman40 on Dec 9, 2013 21:52:51 GMT -5
Well I had a pretty bad week down at the cabin. I think the big thing that hurt us was no acorns. The deer seemed to be close to the fields. We have a ridge that runs along one side of the property that is pretty much all white oak and while the white oaks is usually every other year there was no white oak acorns and what is weird, no red oak acorns this year ether.
It seemed the guys driving were shooting a lot. But they were concentrating it seemed on areas around the fields. On our property there was quite a few scrapes and rubs but seemed to be made by young bucks. All the scrapes were only like a foot in diameter and the rubs were nothing spectacular.
With the new phone in checking system there are some flaws. Of course in Southern Ohio if they can get it in the barn before anybody sees it they don't need no stinking tag.
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Post by jims on Dec 9, 2013 22:04:51 GMT -5
Rossman: What you said about the barn is not too far off but others have done that also. Once during a primitive weapons hunt (in a somewhat different area of the State) I saw a guy with a rifle. I mentioned something about that and he said although it was a centerfire (a 1898 Mauser), it was old and therefore primitive. I did not argue with him as it was his area. The phone in system has its advantages but for the most part I see more disadvantages. Because I hunt on family land I could not call in. I had to go to a computer that had a printer to check in. As we have no electricity on the ground I had to go to a neighbors to do this. That was a pain. This year I just went to the nearest WalMart that was a check station and they ran it through on their computer. They do not even go out and inspect the deer however at all which IMO makes it ripe for problems.
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Post by jims on Dec 11, 2013 16:26:47 GMT -5
I talked with a fellow that hunted SE Ohio last week and he shot a fairly big "doe". When he got there he noticed the area where the antlers had just recently fallen off. Some earlier than others, the bucks I saw all had their headgear except on was one antlered, the other looked partially broken off not dropped. Pretty early for dropping antlers in my area.
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Post by jims on Dec 12, 2013 22:16:33 GMT -5
I saw photos of two others that got Ohio bucks this year. Solid bucks. Some have said last years excellent acorn crop let them come out this Spring in better shape than normal.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2013 17:16:58 GMT -5
I've heard of some folks around here seeing some bucks shedding antlers already as well, definitely seems early. IMO, OH is OH, it's just like the other Midwestern states, there are gonna be big ones taken throughout the state every year, the genetics are here, I believe the problem is, the number of trophy bucks will diminish just as the herd already is, personally "around home" the number of quality bucks has fallen off as bad as the population. I guess OH DNR is doing more than I gave them credit for, they shortened the season and number of tags given out in certain zones, that's a help. I'd love to see them go to an antler restriction (like PA)and or even a system like Wisconsin had or has, first tag is doe only, once you take a doe and check it in, then you can purchase a buck tag. This would help control population in areas they feel they need help in, it would even force folks like myself to shoot a doe before I could go after a buck. UGH!!! but I would and so would many others so they could get after a trophy. (They could put exemptions in place for seniors, youth, handicapped, veterans...etc.) Zones they feel that the population is low, they need to go back or keep it at one deer a year (and maybe they have or will, not sure). Lastly I wish they'd CAN this electronic/phone in game checking system, what a joke. Maybe next year will be the year we see the huge increase in price for nonresident hunters, I've heard talk of them going that route in the past but nothing has happened yet. I'm sure they see what other states like Illinois charge for nonresidents.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2013 17:50:50 GMT -5
I was reading in my latest addition of Bowhunting World magazine, they speak very highly of Ohio DNR and what they are doing, especially vs. other states (comparably Ill.) I guess it's just like the old saying, watch what you wish for and I probably shouldn't complain so much..
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lundy
8 Pointer
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Post by lundy on Dec 13, 2013 19:24:41 GMT -5
OhioGuy, I have a lot of opinions on the Ohio deer herd and management, some of them are good:) I am not even favor of antler restrictions or earn a a buck through requiring a doe harvest first. If we still had a large and growing population the earn a buck through a doe harvest first might make sence, but that is not what we have in Ohio today. Hunting for deer is not and should not be only about antler size. I shoot only mature bucks, but that is my choice for me. I don't want to force that standard on any other hunter. I put together this chart with all of the yearly harvest data on the DNR website. It was hard to compare year to year so I made it easier. As you can see the population has been reduced somewhat from where it was a few years ago Complied results 2013.xls (30 KB)
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