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Post by sunovtra on Apr 22, 2011 13:09:24 GMT -5
Hi! I'm new to this forum and to muzzle loading. I bought my ML 11 and just need a little more info before I go to the range with someone who already owns one. I have bought a package of Hornady 50 cal XTP MAG 240 grain bullets and sabot combo. I know Savage suggests MMP sabots but does anyone have experience with this Hornady set up? I plan on using Accurate Arms 5744 powder. Thanks for any input.
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Post by mike.dawson on Apr 22, 2011 13:27:06 GMT -5
welcome, wrong bullet go get the 250 grain XTP-HP and some AA-5744 and the short mmp black sabot.
go to the load section of the board and read load info. start at 37-44 gr. and you could shoot that forever
Mike
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Post by rossman40 on Apr 22, 2011 13:31:27 GMT -5
The 240gr XTP Mag is not the most accurate bullet probly due to the thicker jacket. They come with the MMP HPH-24 sabot unless you got an older box, that sabot may not be tight enough in your barrel. You can try them and see, if they go down real easy you may want to order some Harvester RCRs or MMP HPH-12s. You can buy some Hornady .452 250gr XTPs or FTXs in bulk (50) fairly cheap.
I keep the 240gr XTPs in the kit box for close in work. You have to have some zip on them to get them to mushroom.
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Post by Richard on Apr 22, 2011 17:59:16 GMT -5
sunovtra.............As an example of how tight? You should be using two hands to push the bullet/sabot down the barrel. If you can seat it with one hand? Its too loose and there is a good chance you will not get ignition. IF, this occurs, (the primer fires but nothing comes out the bore) make sure you re-seat the bullet before firing another primer. The power of just the primer will move the bullet several inches down the barrel. Firing another primer in this condition, could bulge your barrel if it ignites. Many here have "been there/done that!" Smoke less powder is a totally different animal from black powder and BP subs. Smokeless must be under pressure to ignite.
Richard
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jgar
8 Pointer
Posts: 106
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Post by jgar on Apr 23, 2011 18:45:52 GMT -5
The 5744 powder is a good start. Very reliable and easy to ignite...till the speed bug bites you. Anyway, the info already provided is very good. My savage has always shot better with 458 bullets and Harvester black crush rib sabots but every gun is different. I started with this combo and am very happy with it. Remington makes the cheapest 458 300gr jacketed bullets that i can find and combined with a BCR and 40gr -44gr of 5744 you should have a deadly combo.
Read the tips and hint section, it helped me greatly when i was starting out.
Good luck.
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Post by artjr338wm on Apr 23, 2011 22:09:12 GMT -5
Quite good advice so far. When asked for advice on a good starting bullet and sabot combo I always recommend what I started with because it gave me 1.5" to 1" 100yrd three shot groups.
300 grain .452" Hornady XTPs
MMP HPH-12 sabots.
I have since looong stoped using MMP sabots in favor of Harvester because #1-The Harvesters gave me more consistant shot to shot accuracy
#2-Harvesters IMHO are a more durable and heat resistant sabot.
Also keep in mind (and anyone who knows better feel free to correct me) that IIRC the Savage was designed while using the 300 grain .452" XTP and so were all of the Savage factory recommended loads.
As far as the 300 grain .452" XTP is concerned it is one of the most popular bullets for use in the Savage and is about as good a starting bullet as you could ask for. It has a well earned rep for being a accurate and cheap bullet that has killed train car loads of deer just dont push it much at all past 2300fps.
I recommend you first develop a accurate base line load using cheaper XTPs then you can if you wish exparrament with other bullet types, as there are more out there than you might think.
The Harvester smooth black sabots and the black crushed rib sabots are IMHO the nest sabots out there for use with .452-.458" bullets.
Go to Harvester's website get their 800# call them tell them the bullets you plan on using and they will likely send you a free sabot sample pack for you to try.
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Post by 10ga on Apr 25, 2011 12:36:27 GMT -5
sunovtra, Welcome! I was where you are a couple of years ago. There is a lot of info here. Use the search engine and check out the tips and hints. The 240 gr. isn't a very good choice for the Savage. There are several threads that address how newbies should start to avoid the problems. dougsmessageboards.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=smokeless&thread=3464&page=1This is just one thread. Many others are available through the search engine. My short list! 1. Clean that Savage. Very clean, The bores are notoriously dirty from the factory. 2. Stick with factory loads until you are familiar with how it works. 3. Mark your ramrod! Very important, do not double load! 4. Weigh your charges, do not trust volume measure. 5. 250 or 300 gr. .458 cal and BCR (black crush rib) is probably best start bullet. 6. Shoot a cool barrel. Heat is the enemy of sabots. 7. Lurk and search about on the board. 8. Ask questions and you'll get plenty of help. Again, Welcome! Best, 10 ga |
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Post by jray57 on Apr 25, 2011 12:53:20 GMT -5
"5. 250 or 300 sst and BCR (black crush rib) is probably best start bullet. 300 gr .458s are really good too."
The black crush rib sabot is way too loose with .452's in my gun. They do work well with the .458's though.
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Post by rmclaughlin on Apr 25, 2011 14:48:51 GMT -5
Might as well order you a 45cal Barrel for your savage,A SMI barrel for your encore and a 40 for a MCGowen build.This thing gets addictive quickly.Have fun with it. ;D
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Post by tar12 on Apr 25, 2011 16:28:00 GMT -5
The 240 grn xtp in either version is .430 dia. Not good. You can avoid a lot of wasted time and go straight to .458 dia bullets as that is where you will realize your best accuracy out of a .50. This has been proven time and again.
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Post by sunovtra on Apr 26, 2011 18:56:22 GMT -5
Thanks for all the help! I will be doing some more lurking around this forum for all the info I can find. Thanks again!
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Post by morgan1109 on Apr 29, 2011 14:47:01 GMT -5
That is the very same bullet and sabot set up I took to my first range session with AA 5744. It went horribly. With a normal amount of 5744 I was blowing those sabots and the accuracy was extremely bad. Even at short ranges. You need a sabot that can take the higher pressures generated by a smokeless gun. MMP and Harvester are the ones I would gravitate toward. After the mishap above I switched to MMP sabots and .452 diameter bullets and the improvement was almost unbelievable. Eventually I settled on .458 bullets (Barnes original) and harvester black crush ribs.
A different sabot and a different bullet may shoot better in your gun. You’ll have to try a few to find out what your gun likes. These guys told me a .458 bullet will shoot better (less plastic on the sides to mess you up) in the savage. My own testing supported it. They also taught me a tight fitting sabot that doesn’t tear or stretch going down the barrel yields better groups. My own testing supported it.
Good luck.
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