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Post by lastofthebreed on Mar 24, 2011 23:05:57 GMT -5
i have been shooting my new .45 elite with 4-16x50 bdc nikon with 100gr. of bh209 with a .40cal 200 grain sst with a tan sabot at different yardages,100,200 & 300 yards.
it is sighted 4" high @ 100 yards useing the crosshairs.
useing the 1st bdc circle under the crosshairs,its in the bull @ 200 yards.
but i had to use the 4th bdc circle under the crosshairs to get 300 yards,1st shot was an inch high & 4" left,2nd shot was an inch high & 3" right & the 3rd shot was less than an inch high right above the 3" bulls eye.it was a tad windy that day,with it coming from the north & me shooting n/e.
i only have 20 shots threw the gun & scope as it sits from new,i think with more practice that i will beable to shrink that 300 yard group some.
i was wondering if i should up the powder,110 or 120gr.?
i like it not kicking with what i am shooting now.
or where can i find some .40cal 150gr. to 180gr. bullets for long range?
i want to beable to have enough energy @ 300 yards for a clean kill on a mature whitetail if i can find the right load.
thanx in advance!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2011 7:35:22 GMT -5
I read your post and noticed your using tan sabots, you might get better results with blue ones. It seems that they are the favorite choice of the .45 cal crew. My 2 cents.
Greenhorn
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Post by spaniel on Mar 25, 2011 8:21:28 GMT -5
It will be a fool's errand to try and get the trajectory to exactly match the BDC. Very low likelihood you will get it right on at all distances, you will need to settle for "close enough" or just learn how to compensate for the error. This is why I use a tactical scope and dial for range -- I like the precision.
#1, there are not a lot of lighter bullets available. #2, any that are will have a much lower BC than the 200SST and are going to drop a lot faster. #3, because they are lighter and have a lower BC they are going to drift more and at long range wind is even more of a problem than drop -- you can accurately predict drop. #4, even with the 200SST 300 yards is getting very near the limit of where I would shoot a deer with a conventional ML. I have shot several between 300-338 yds, all were clean kills, but based on the lack of shock damage outside the wound channel at 338 yds I will never go further than that with the 200SST. This was 110gr 777 at 2100fps MV. A lighter bullet will only do worse.
If you want flatter trajectory and more energy sure, you can try upping the charge and still see if your group size stays where it needs to be. I have never gotten up to max charge in my guns with the 200SST without losing accuracy so I always stopped at the highest accurate load (2100fps in my main gun as listed above).
The 200SST is the best you are going to do for a long range bullet in a .45cal -- it is a great bullet. There are no options with a higher BC that you can put in a sabot for a .45. Look over on the smokeless board, people shoot either the 200SST or the 195gr Barnes (lower BC). Since mine was a .50cal I switched to the 325FTX, which I could shoot at 1950fps with a max charge (135gr) of 777 and duplicate the trajectory of the 200SST with half the drift and twice the energy at all ranges past 200 yds (shot it to 500).
If you learned to shoot sabotless with a .45cal bullet (requires sizing and knurling), the 250-270gr Parker Ballistic Extreme bullets may shoot flatter.
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Post by lastofthebreed on Mar 25, 2011 12:13:36 GMT -5
(((It will be a fool's errand to try and get the trajectory to exactly match the BDC.)))
i relise this......now if they only made a scope with moveable bdc circles,problem solved......heck maybe they do,but i could not afford one.
i only have 20 shots with this muzzle loader & scope,its still in the learning process for me & the gun,lol.
i sight all my deer guns in at 4" high @ 100 yards,i was surprised when the 200 yard shot hit the bull with the 1st bdc & the 300 yard shots were only an inch high but with the 4th circle.
i just did not think i would be useing the last bdc circle to get the 300 yards,there are 2 more circles inbetween the 1st circle that i use for 200 & the last circle i use for 300.
yeah i know there are not alot of choices in bullets or sabots for the .45,just seeing if there was anything i missed or someone else tried or something new that i dont know about.i will try the blue sabots!
i know they make a .40 180 gr. sst,but cant find them at the local stores.i guess i will shop online.
i want to try the 180gr. sst with 120gr. of bh209 & see how it shoots? should have a little less belly in it.
i am not wanting to go the knurling route,as of right now.
does anyone know what fps the 100gr. of bh209 with the .40 200gr sst is?
or fps for 120gr. of bh209 & the .40 180gr. sst?
many years ago...........i was shooting the .45 150gr. xtp pistol bullets with 120gr. of powder out of my hastings .50 barrel that was on my mossberg 500 & harvested every deer i shot at with it up to 200 yards.you would always find the bullet under the skin on the other side,if it was 20 yards away or 200.
thanx for the responces.
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Post by mountainam on Mar 25, 2011 12:21:36 GMT -5
Lastofthebreed, I'd up the charge but dump the tan sabot for a Harvester lt blue.
Since you're shooting BH209 you may want to go to a .357" 180gr HornadyXTP or a Hornady .358" 200RN while using a PR Bullet proprietary .357x.45 ORANGE sabot. They should shoot somewhat flatter due to the smaller dia. I haven't tested them with BH209, but I was clocking the 180 XTP at 2284fps with 140grs loose FFFG T7. I don't recall the velocity on the .358 200grRN. Both shot very accurate. The downside is only when using smokeless they WILL drill the sabots. I've never had it happen with BP subs.
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Post by lastofthebreed on Mar 25, 2011 14:09:01 GMT -5
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Post by mountainam on Mar 25, 2011 14:57:24 GMT -5
Yes, Those are the ones.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2011 18:15:30 GMT -5
Here is some data from my .45 Encore 26" barrel with 100gr BH209.
200gr SST in blue Harvester sabot, ave. velocity 2087fps
195gr Barnes MZ in blue Harvester sabot, ave. velocity 2109fps
155gr Barnes TAC in MMP tan, ave. velocity 2190 - blue Harvester ave. velocity 2185
I thought I had some data written down for the PR 250 and 215QT's but I cannot find it anywhere. I want to say the PR250QT was around 1900fps with 100gr BH209. Midway has General Copper 155gr .40 bullets available and they shoot very well but I would not try shooting a deer at 300yds with it.
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Post by sabotloader on Mar 26, 2011 15:18:37 GMT -5
Here is some data from my .45 Encore 26" barrel with 100gr BH209. 200gr SST in blue Harvester sabot, ave. velocity 2087fps 195gr Barnes MZ in blue Harvester sabot, ave. velocity 2109fps 155gr Barnes TAC in MMP tan, ave. velocity 2190 - blue Harvester ave. velocity 2185 I thought I had some data written down for the PR 250 and 215QT's but I cannot find it anywhere. I want to say the PR250QT was around 1900fps with 100gr BH209. Midway has General Copper 155gr .40 bullets available and they shoot very well but I would not try shooting a deer at 300yds with it. Your ballistics seem very close to mine...  |
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Post by spaniel on Mar 26, 2011 19:00:24 GMT -5
There is no 180 SST -- there is a 180gr Hornaday bullet but it is a hollowpoint and will drop like a rock...MAYBE a 200yd bullet but no way at 300.
The blue Harvestor sabots will stand up to smokeless pressures and 3000fps velocities...I think they should do very will for you in an inline.
There is no such thing as a BDC with movable circles, but you can get a tactical scope with target turrets very affordably. Check out the Nikon Buckmaster. When you take the covers off the turrets, it has hand-adjustable, MOA-marked turrets. Bushnell also has some affordable tactical scopes that track well. You just have a chart taped on your stock telling you how many MOA for each range in 25 or 50-yd increments and dial it in. Sure it takes a minute but if the deer is not still and calm enough to do it, you shouldn't be shooting 200-300yds at them anyways!
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Post by lastofthebreed on Mar 26, 2011 21:22:32 GMT -5
i thought that i have seen the 180gr sst advertised before on the net a few months ago....i just checked & found none.
it would be cool if the bdc circles were adjustable.....
i have 2 tactical scopes,both cheapy bsa.
1 on my .22 & the other on my .17 they work good & i do enjoy them.they both get alot of action...living out in the country on 40 acres these 2 get alot of use......
i also have a nikon buckmaster 4.5-14x40 on my kodiak .45 that i need to shoot more often,on the last day of are muzzle loader season i harvested what i thought was a nice big doe & ended up being a buck that already shed......bummer.
trust me... if i cant pull off the 300 yards,i wont do it.its that simple.....i get to much enjoyment out of just watching the deer....i hardly shoot them like i use too years ago.
last year i shot 2 & this year was a perfect year,1 with the bow,1 with the shotgun & 1 with the muzzle loader.and i hunt almost every day season is open........
thats why i am asking for all your thoughts.....good,bad or indifferent!
thanx greenhorn & mountainam for the info on the blue sabots! cant wait to try them.
thanx 45omega & sabotloader for the ballistics!
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