Recommendations for gun

[srb338]

Hello, new to this site and was hoping for some help. Seems like the more I read the less I know about MZ. I was hoping for some help/recommendations for purchasing a new MZ with a few requirements. Here in Oregon we have a lot more restrictions on what we can use....NO 209, NO closed ignition, NO scope and NO sabots are allowed. I plan on using this gun out of state as well and was wondering if anyone can give me some recommendations (make, manufacturers) for .50 cal muzzleloaders and bullets for hunting elk and deer. I have looked at Knights, Traditions, and Remingtons and now realize how many more there are out there. Money is not too much of a factor here. Thanks.

[GMB54-120]

Knight MK-85 in either 50 or 54cal

And one of the best for your needs White Super 91 .504 or 54cal Bison.

Either one should comply with your needs but are no longer made. MKs do show up still NIB and are the best value.

All the above are deadly accurate too.

I might still have a source for NIB MK-85s in 54cal SS/Composite in the $200 range.

[10ga]

SRB338, With those restrictions you can go traditional. Hammer gun and #11 caps. For better sighting go to a peep sight. I have several Cabellas hammer guns, 50 and 58, and a 50 cal Lyman. I have Lyman peep sights on all 3 with "firesight" front sight. All shoot good and are accurate. You can use the powerbelt type or TC maxi type bullets for hunting but I have found patched roundball just fine for deer sized game. Longest kill with roundball was 105 yard shootthrough with the 50 cal. = Load is 110 gr of FFF Swiss BP, deer tallow lubed pillowtick patch around a .490 RB. When my eyes were good i could bust a clay pigeon hung on the backstop at 100 yards with every shot. The bullets, which I use in my inlines, should be good for deer or elk=(which I haven't ML hunted but my bro in CO has) as they get incredible penetration at BP velocities. In whichever gun you choose I recommend using real black powder. You gotta clean them guns up anyway and the BP is way better than the subs. For inlines look for a TC Thunderhawk, Firehawk or Black Diamond. They are inline and have the faster twist, 1 in 28" I think, but have "open" ignition and originally used #11 caps. They are no longer in production but regularly available at gun shows and sometimes in the online auctions. Only the Black Diamond has a removeable breechplug. I have 2 Firehawks, mine and my daughters, and they shoot super. They handle belted bullets and the conicals real good. Only drawback is they are light and that means a bit more recoil. The firehawks have retrofitted Williams Firesights and they are nice. Used the Firehawks until last year and got a MLII. Too bad your state regs cut you out of the MLII. The traditional type hammer guns with #11 caps, patched roundball, and BP is about the cheapest high-power shooting you will ever do, cast your own roundballs and cut your own patches and it's under $.20 a shot. My $.02 worth. What works for me! 10 ga
PM or post if you have more questions.

[smokepole50]

Even with all the restrictions you mentioned you have a few good choices. The biggest issues are how far are you going to be carring this Elk rifle when you hunt and how far are you going to try and shoot a Elk at, distance? Another issue is how traditional do you want to look. Inline ignitions are nice but I still like my sidelocks.

As far as a Knight and a heavy conical bullet like a Horn." Buffalo Bullet" I would go with the MK-85 because of the Green Mountain barrel. Green Mountain barrels are what the muzzle loader compeditors shoot in custom rifles, they are very accurate.

A cheap but effective 50 cal would be the T/C Black Diamond but I have never used mine with a #11 cap and I would have reliable ignition concerns with its BP even using Black Powder. Slam fire sucks for cleaning as well. Taking the entire bolt apart everytime you clean it will get old after awhile, trust me.

Another fine option would be to find a cheap .50 Cal T/C Hawken side lock and change out the original barrel to a drop in Green Mountain "Long Range Hunter"barrel. They can still be bought from Green Mountain distributers and cost around $230. The LRH barrels are very accurate with a 1:28 twist. I have one and it shoots very accurately. Use Maxi-balls or heavier Buffalo Bullets and it won't have any trouble with a Elk. You can even put a scope on one if you can still get the off-set mount from T/C as the LRH barrel is D&T for it. Flip up long range sights on the barrel tang are also a option.

For a round ball gun I would consider a Lyman Great Plains rifle in 54 cal. I have one and it is very accurate with its Buck Horn style rear sight, and would be even better with a flip up peep sight. Remember flip up, not a peep mounted on the rear of the barrel as your only sight but on the tang. Flip's up cost more but when you can't see thru peep sights you don't want them in the way. The 54 cal. shoots a 220gr round ball and you can get the velocity up and thump a Elk with it just fine at range, they did it for many years. It looks just like a original Hawken and that rifle killed a many Elk and Bear long before Inline's were ever thought of. Use a CVA #11 cap keeper (orange plastic thing) on your nipple and it will be water tight and fire every time with Black Powder. When I first built my Lyman Great Plains rifle kit, I could hit a soda can every shot at 50 yards, they are very accurate rifle's and some use them for a cheaper competition rifle when they first start shooting in matches with the NMLRA shoots.

Smokepole50