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Post by orionsoracle on Nov 18, 2010 16:55:13 GMT -5
So once again,doing allot of reading and learning about different companies for muzzle loading. Precision rifle custom muzzle loader bullets,are they all what they claim to be? Are they boa-tailed or tapered perhaps? Anyone use these? Also they taut a duplex sabot. WOW,anybody ever mess with those? If so please post some results. Thanks
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Post by spaniel on Nov 18, 2010 19:06:02 GMT -5
They are a stepped boattail, yes. And yes, they have a high BC, though nowhere near what they claim on the site. If you read Cecil's description of calculating BC, they shoot it and determine it, and run it on a computer, and give it the highest of the two (the computer, of course, which has no basis in reality).
They do shoot well when used at the right velocity (more on that later), and their terminal performance is good (at the right velocity). I used them for several years with Triple Seven.
The problem is that, being pure lead, they are limited to 1800-2000 fps muzzle velocity. Above that the bullet will deform upon acceleration and accuracy will be terrible. If you are willing to limit yourself to this (which kind of defeats an advantage of smokeless), I am sure they will do well for you.
This is where their whole "flattest shooting bullet" claim becomes complete BS and frankly I stopped buying their products after they posted and started touting that. They only use 100gr BP equivalent in that test, they say it is to standardize but what that does is keep the velocity down to where their bullets are favored. They also left off a couple very high BC bullets (like the 200SW) that were available when that test was run.
Basically, in a BP gun you can shoot the 200SW, push it faster with more powder, and beat any PR bullet. In smokeless there is not even a comparison.
The other issue I personally had with them is that they stoutly denied to me that there was a velocity issue and said their bullets shoot well at any velocity and it was MY fault their bullets would not shoot at 2100fps.
They have a good product when it is used properly...when a seller needs to start being misleading I start losing interest.
As for the duplex sabots, most people cannot get them to shoot. I had one BP gun that shot them very well and I had good luck with them out to 300 yards (MOA or better). I absolutely guarantee your results would be past abysmal with smokeless and those!!
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Post by GMB54-120 on Nov 18, 2010 20:25:54 GMT -5
Ive only shot the 40x45 250gr QT aka Cabelas Extended Range.
They do shoot well at just under 2000fps and that isnt bad for BH209 pushing a 250gr bullet but as Spaniel mentioned after that, accuracy went south fast and i tried all 3 currently available sabots.
My best repeatable groups at 100 yards were 1.5-2.0" and i dont think i ever got any to shoot better in either of my non smokeless 45s.
My resized Meister Cast ,401-260gr RNFPs shoot just as well (groups) at 1950fps and only cost me about 15 cents each.
I do like their Ultimate Conical QT 45cals but only with subs of course. Way over priced but their 360gr Ultimate is deadly accurate.
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Post by mountainam on Nov 18, 2010 20:46:37 GMT -5
PR does have a proprietary sabot in .45x357 that is made for them by MMP. They shoot awesome with Hornady .357 180gr XTP's and Hornady .358" 200gr RN using T7 FFFG. The velocities were near 2350fps, but as Spaniel says, don't go over 2100fps with the pure lead. And don't shoot the 45x357 sabots with smokeless. They will drill the sabots with all but the slowest burning powders.
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Post by mike3132 on Nov 18, 2010 21:45:07 GMT -5
Do yourself a favor and stick with jacketed bullets. They are very easy to shoot in the Savage. Mike
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Post by dwhunter on Nov 19, 2010 8:56:46 GMT -5
Do yourself a favor and stick with jacketed bullets. They are very easy to shoot in the Savage. Mike I agree if you want to shoot pure lead get a flintlock. |
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Post by spaniel on Nov 19, 2010 9:57:39 GMT -5
Do yourself a favor and stick with jacketed bullets. They are very easy to shoot in the Savage. Mike I agree if you want to shoot pure lead get a flintlock. I would not go that far. With a MV of 1600-2000 fps (depending where they lose accuracy in your gun), PR bullets have excellent terminal performance. |
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Post by edge on Nov 19, 2010 11:55:49 GMT -5
I shot a 300 grain .45 QT in my 50 caliber under a big load of Lil'Gun with a couple of wads  This was one of my most accurate hunting loads ever in my stock Savage. Shot a deer right at 200 yards and got a splat! Probably a 6 - 8 inch wound and only 2 -3 inches deep with shrapnel making tiny holes deeper. There was no bullet size hole in the chest cavity and while the animal dropped at the shot it was not dead for a fair amount of time. I gave the other 100 or so to my friend with a Knight along with the 235 grain .40 bullets that were worthless in the Savage ;D edge. PS I also had problems with misfires if I left it loaded for a couple of hours. Make sure you stick with an easy ignition powder! |
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Post by mike3132 on Nov 19, 2010 11:57:39 GMT -5
We've been threw this discussion before and PR all lead bullets have a tendency to miss-fire using smokeless powder. Many guys had this problem especially when left loaded over night.
There is nothing wrong with shooting lead bullets but for smokeless muzzle loading jacketed bullets are a better choice for most. Mike
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Post by spaniel on Nov 20, 2010 8:31:55 GMT -5
We've been threw this discussion before and PR all lead bullets have a tendency to miss-fire using smokeless powder.Mike I forgot about the misfire issue. It was the flintlock reference that threw me, they work just fine in inlines. Haven't seen a flintlock with a 1:28 twist yet  |
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Post by garner308 on Dec 3, 2010 1:12:47 GMT -5
I lost 2 deer this year with those PR bullets 50 cal. 240 grain guy next door shot the (148inch) deer 3 days later bullet went straight through no exspantion top of the shoulder and almost the complete right lung .... the bullets are now somewhere in the woods behind my house and thats were there staying ......... copper and lead or all copper from now on should have known ive been shooting to long .. but hey we all make mistakes .
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Post by garner308 on Dec 3, 2010 1:13:46 GMT -5
I lost 2 deer this year with those PR bullets 50 cal. 240 grain guy next door shot the (148inch) deer 3 days later bullet went straight through no exspantion top of the shoulder and almost the complete right lung .... the bullets are now somewhere in the woods behind my house and thats were there staying ......... copper and lead or all copper from now on should have known ive been shooting to long .. but hey we all make mistakes .
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