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Post by overtheir on Jul 5, 2022 19:02:49 GMT -5
I picked up a box of federal 209m but i use 209a federal will it make a difference in 45 cal pressure is what im thinking
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Post by tar12 on Jul 6, 2022 16:15:32 GMT -5
The difference is minor...send it..
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Post by sideshow on Jul 21, 2022 4:56:41 GMT -5
Just because this is labeled 209 primers i thought id add this in here . Woodman Arms is making Brass moduals that hold Large Rifle primers but are EXACTLY LIKE A 209 !!! Reloadable or toss them THEYRE INEXPENSIVE !!! Nice Stuff !!!
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Post by GMB54-120 on Jul 27, 2022 9:00:49 GMT -5
FED209M is a muzzleloading primer. FED209A is a mag primer.
CCI209M however is a mag primer. No idea what Federal is using in the newest ML primers but the old ones were weak.
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Post by mrbuck on Jul 28, 2022 12:11:36 GMT -5
The CCI209M seems to be a lot cleaner leaving much less carbon in the breechplug .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2022 17:52:58 GMT -5
What are the modules made for that Mark is making that looks like a 209 primer?Break open or bolt action muzzleloader/What is the cost compared to buying 209 primers?
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Post by sideshow on Jul 29, 2022 2:48:34 GMT -5
What are the modules made for tghat Mark is making that looks like a 209 primer?Break open or bolt action muzzleloader/What is the cost compared to buying 209 p rimers? I forget at the moment what costs are . Its ALOT Less than ASG moduals are i do remeber that much !!! Theyre made to be AFFORDABLE . A bolt or break action use the same primers just as these are for either/or . This really isnt about "costs" so much as preformance improvement . Give Him a call !!! Thats the best way to know for sure .
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Post by mike.dawson on Jul 29, 2022 11:51:32 GMT -5
Just because this is labeled 209 primers i thought id add this in here . Woodman Arms is making Brass moduals that hold Large Rifle primers but are EXACTLY LIKE A 209 !!! Reloadable or toss them THEYRE INEXPENSIVE !!! Nice Stuff !!! Ive been working with mark, the new ones he sent me after retooling the brass module. The will take a large rifle or large pistol primers as well. Reloadable and are the same dimension as Fed 209A primer. They fit the bolt nose on my Savage ML 2 as well as the bolt nose on my Remington ML converted and my Knight original disc where Jeff made the BP for it. As soon as it cools of some here in Tampa they will be tested.
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Post by sideshow on Jul 29, 2022 18:35:38 GMT -5
Just because this is labeled 209 primers i thought id add this in here . Woodman Arms is making Brass moduals that hold Large Rifle primers but are EXACTLY LIKE A 209 !!! Reloadable or toss them THEYRE INEXPENSIVE !!! Nice Stuff !!! Ive been working with mark, the new ones he sent me after retooling the brass module. The will take a large rifle or large pistol primers as well. Reloadable and are the same dimension as Fed 209A primer. They fit the bolt nose on my Savage ML 2 as well as the bolt nose on my Remington ML converted and my Knight original disc where Jeff made the BP for it. As soon as it cools of some here in Tampa they will be tested. While i cant speak for smokeless YET due to the gunsmith is BUSY , for bh209 i Can . In my Hunter converted 50 smoker 700ml barrel With 84 grW compressed to 75lb first with a 300gr / crush rib sitting on top after compression @ .004 interferance fit over 5 shots i got about 100fps increase consistantly over Federal 209a . This to me was wonderfull preformance increases from Marks brass Large rifle primer moduals for 209 fitment !!! This 50 cal barrel and a 54 will be kept just in case with this WTO swtch-lug rig when completed with a smokless capable light-weght shouldered 416 with a Woodman adj 209 plugged barrel as well . Gonna be a nice rig .
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Post by mike.dawson on Aug 4, 2022 10:15:10 GMT -5
I have the correct modules from Mark, but you need a arbor press to press the primers into the pocket something I don't have plus some sort of tool to set the modules in while using the press, again something I don't have. They are not pressed in by hand but a press is needed.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2022 12:57:12 GMT -5
Can a regular 209 primer work as well as the magnum orimers you'all are talking about?
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Post by sideshow on Aug 6, 2022 13:36:34 GMT -5
I have the correct modules from Mark, but you need a arbor press to press the primers into the pocket something I don't have plus some sort of tool to set the modules in while using the press, again something I don't have. They are not pressed in by hand but a press is needed. i used a breech plug for a smoker to do it in a lee hand press . I fashioned a adapter and rod . It wasnt hard to do i thought .
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Post by sideshow on Aug 6, 2022 13:39:06 GMT -5
Can a regular 209 primer work as well as the magnum orimers you'all are talking about? As long as it goes boom its surely a start !!!
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Post by tar12 on Aug 7, 2022 5:59:45 GMT -5
FED209M is a muzzleloading primer. FED209A is a mag primer. CCI209M however is a mag primer. No idea what Federal is using in the newest ML primers but the old ones were weak. I ran a flat of the Fed 209M through a .45 conversion over the course of several testing sessions with no issues...the numbers were slightly slower than the Fed209A ...I did have some issues with a batch of Remington 209 ML primers ..I switched to Fed209a and never looked back..
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2022 9:01:28 GMT -5
Why is it when something new comes out to improve our shooting,we always HAVE to buy something else to make it work?Just once I would like to buy somethinmg that works as indicated and not buy more to make it work as intended.209 primers will do just fine the way they are.No modules needed.
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Post by sideshow on Aug 7, 2022 15:41:03 GMT -5
Why is it when something new i comes out to improve our shooting,we always HAVE to buy something else to make it work?Just once I would like to buy somethinmg that works as indicated and not buy more to make it work as intended.209 primers will do just fine the way they are.No modules needed. Thats why we have choices . If you are happy with what you have stay with it . Some guys find they must duplex using 209s , others dont have to . Would a 209modual/LRP CURE that ?? Try it and see ?? What about obturation ?? Each of us encounter different things at times . A blanket answer for these rifles just doesnt fit or so it seems . I like the ability to tinker , to seek something better . Some guys dont . They want a turn key operation . Thats fine for them and i get it . But better has always drove us forward . I personally like that motion . All of us found ourselves with a SML for a Reason and to prep for that alone was costly $$$ . Bank statement says #11s and T7 were just dandy !!! But a duplexed #11 / 10gr T7 3F / 77grW bh209 compressed worked Even Better . Before anybody says anything Tony Knight and Doc White BOTH found this ok !!! I figure my liver never squeaked that bad where i Have to lube it every weekend and bowling bores me to death . No desire Ever for "Goof" either chaseing the ball all over hill and dale . Everything costs us one way or another . The TRUE BEST is DI but we pay for that with Hassle but CAN save on powder IF it gives us what we want for velocity goals AND we dont want MORE . Eyes wide open and our minds too achieve much ..... Whatchagunnado ??
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Post by ET on Aug 8, 2022 7:24:06 GMT -5
Why is it when something new comes out to improve our shooting,we always HAVE to buy something else to make it work?Just once I would like to buy somethinmg that works as indicated and not buy more to make it work as intended.209 primers will do just fine the way they are.No modules needed. Brownisdown I feel we are of the same mindset concerning 209 primers. The gain for using something new isn’t always a major improvement and sometimes complicates equipment usage. I’m more than happy for using 209 primers as is and simply inserting a 209 primer directly into the bolt nose. What I see with the different development of BP configuration is to increase Primer Thermal Energy Delivery for slower burning powders. Motivation for this is higher velocities. Nothing wrong with that if that is your goal. In my case I don’t need real high velocities for out to 200yds, my imposed range. I just need a dependable ignition source for the powder I use and the plain 209 works just fine for me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2022 8:06:55 GMT -5
K.I.S.S.
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Post by sideshow on Aug 8, 2022 13:56:59 GMT -5
Guys i agree in part . My current build 700ml will be a 209 type ignition but adjustable for headspace and flame channel from Woodman Arms . I just have different goals , 4 to 500yds , with it and a unique approach to pull it off too with a light weight build using light to medium smokless loads or heavier bh209 loads . No chamber . A lite carry weight "Paramount 40" preformance duplicate sorta with SML ability . Other have done it already but used LMRP HIS or Asg moduals . My 2 heavier builds use those .
Brownisdown the Patriot youve got ordered will be fine with 209s probably and is a outstanding value of an awesome rifle !!! In addition id still get Marks plug like i did though . At 6lbs you wont be shooting heavy bullets or loads with it anyway if your smart . The barrel isnt heavy enough either . But that Patriot isnt about that . If its really cold in your season though dont be suprised if you gotta duplex though or use the 209 moduals . Just sayin..... its possible . Thats as KISS as it gets . I will be 2 lbs heavier scoped and i envy your weight though .
ET i just need more range from my rifles . My smoker i can reach 200 or a bit further with it easy but i honestly hate the mess !!! 400gr with 320bc will sail a ways out there !!! You can use the newer ignitions better in really cold weather or to help a really light load obturate better even with a fast powder . Guys do that . Extra speed with slower powders Do generally go with Heavier builds though using the more intensive ignitions . Both ways are good things . All 3 of us are barrel limited so thats not for these rifles with big heavy fast bullets . Ive just come to appreciate the other options that Are available NOW For A 209 System with Woodmans 209 moduals and adj breech plug . Theyre a pretty nice development for ALOT of guys !!!
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Post by ET on Aug 8, 2022 20:13:46 GMT -5
All 3 of us are barrel limited so thats not for these rifles with big heavy fast bullets . That I can't buy as my Savage is quite capable of shooting big heavy fast bullets. The key is finding the right powder load. Peak pressure doesn't fully dictate the resulting velocity. The remaining level of pressure after peak pressure influences the final velocity outcome.
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Post by sideshow on Aug 9, 2022 4:42:19 GMT -5
All 3 of us are barrel limited so thats not for these rifles with big heavy fast bullets . That I can't buy as my Savage is quite capable of shooting big heavy fast bullets. The key is finding the right powder load. Peak pressure doesn't fully dictate the resulting velocity. The remaining level of pressure after peak pressure influences the final velocity outcome. We are getting pretty far off topic but yes the backside of the curve matters . But what it really boils down to is how big is big and how fast is fast and what caliber we are talking using a 209 especially if its cold out ?? If i recall you use a 50 and may have a 45 Savage too ?? Im looking at this from a 416 , 1.220 shanked Rem on a 5.5 contour . I dont think im that far off base just to look at velocities from what ive heard you speak of shot . And if you are speaking of fast and big that 209 is getting some help from duplex most likely but thats not needed for only 200 yds either . So where is my error Even if distance is stretched out further beyond 200yd limit you self impose ?? Duplex kinda leaves simple behind and 300gr at maybe 2600 single powdered isnt really that fast for a 45 and good easy to 400 but can be a bit much for a 209 to ignite when cold . But its still flirting with 45,000 & 4198 id say and hard to get a backside without that peak using 209s . Thats getting to the end of the line for a barrel nut gun . Just where am i wrong because i didnt think i overlooked much ?? 209s right and cold too ?? Cold i consider automatically cause thats my conditions stated or not for the most important use on hair . For the distance i know BC will carry the 416 even loaded milder contour considered vs other calibers and barrels and pressures . I even got .015 jackets with pure lead cores to obturate those up to 300gr customs if needed vs my furys , pittmans , or 340 cutting edge . I dont mind the 209 modual or a duplex to do it if i need to even when cold out . Im not seeing error here in what ive said ?? Temp , 209s , contour , caliber All play a part for limits on big and heavy especially kept simple with 1 powder . Somewhere 1 limits the other . None of it cares whose name is on the action .
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Post by ET on Aug 9, 2022 13:30:00 GMT -5
Sideshow
The one thing I agree upon is we are getting off topic. After making that comment you still persist in making off topic commentaries. What does that say?
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Post by sideshow on Aug 9, 2022 15:49:31 GMT -5
Sideshow The one thing I agree upon is we are getting off topic. After making that comment you still persist in making off topic commentaries. What does that say? Thats says i answered your reply while attempting to keep it on topic with pertinate related material .
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Post by ET on Aug 9, 2022 18:31:53 GMT -5
Sideshow The one thing I agree upon is we are getting off topic. After making that comment you still persist in making off topic commentaries. What does that say? Thats says i answered your reply while attempting to keep it on topic with pertinate related material . Well then I will look forward to reading your range results and how your pertinent info applies.
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Post by GMB54-120 on Aug 10, 2022 9:55:14 GMT -5
Thats says i answered your reply while attempting to keep it on topic with pertinate related material . Well then I will look forward to reading your range results and how your pertinent info applies. We all love range reports with pics
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Post by sideshow on Aug 10, 2022 12:32:50 GMT -5
Well then I will look forward to reading your range results and how your pertinent info applies. We all love range reports with pics Gm54-120 nobody is looking forward to this 700ml 3 barreled 209 switch rig build more than me being done !!! My local F-class builder is just Swamped however . A 45 Rem/Brux i had recieved and joined it with a much lighter Rem/Brux shouldered 40 which is a jewel of a hotrod . But this Rem 700ml/Wilson build is a different animal with a different mindset altogether . From conicals to solid copper with 780bc theres something for everybody , smokein or not . 54 ,50 , & 416 , 210gr to 535gr . It just makes sense .....
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Post by billyboy on Aug 19, 2022 12:57:02 GMT -5
I have the correct modules from Mark, but you need a arbor press to press the primers into the pocket something I don't have plus some sort of tool to set the modules in while using the press, again something I don't have. They are not pressed in by hand but a press is needed. i used a breech plug for a smoker to do it in a lee hand press . I fashioned a adapter and rod . It wasnt hard to do i thought . Could you Please post a photo of your Set Up?
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Post by sideshow on Aug 19, 2022 19:45:12 GMT -5
i used a breech plug for a smoker to do it in a lee hand press . I fashioned a adapter and rod . It wasnt hard to do i thought . Could you Please post a photo of your Set Up? Billyboy what i did isnt complicated . I used a old CVA 5/8 209 bp and made a thread adapter to fit my Lee hand reloading/bullet sizer press of 7/8 i think ?? The rod was made with a cut shorter one from a sizing die from Hankins . I knock the old primers out on a alum block drilled to a tad over the rim diameter only maybe 1/8 deep and the center part drilled thru so the primers fall taped out with a hammer and punch and collect till i pitch them in the trash . Im no-where close to home now and wont be for a few to several days at least . Best i got . Oh i used black pipe i had to make that thread adapter . A vice and a big tap and die set . Cut to what you need with a hack saw after you got it threaded inside and outside . I left about a 1/4 inch on the od to hold onto with fingers above the threads . Took a file to the sharps on it and get stuff square . It honestly isnt fancy but it works good . Not really that different than sizeing bullets with the hand press actually . Place the modual in the bp , set a primer on top and let the resized rod come down to push the primer in so it just takes a little squeaze at the end of its stroke to seat it . All done . Next !!! Lol !!! Just be carefull through these steps you dont Distort/crush/bend that modual as thats your Headspaced SEAL !!! New everytime isnt a bad idea either as they Wont be expensive according to Woodman Arms . Thats what i will do with the Woodman adj bp and smokless useing a front .004" crush seal . A OD seal id try to reuse them as ive already done with bh209 and a smoker 700ml Hunter 209 bp . All hand tools and ingenuity. Nothin fancy . This explanation should help you More than pics of a finished product in all honesty . A regular hand primer MAY have a holder to work with that 209 modual better/faster i dont know ?? I used what i had on hand and havent looked into it further ?? 25 ACP Maybe or similar ?? One day i will . Thats what i use for the other two rifles with ASG and Hankins moduals is a hand primer press with a 308 case holder . At this point i have no idea which if any case holder would work For Sure with a 209 modual . If you find out let me know !!!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2022 14:21:23 GMT -5
Received some 209 primer modules from Mark Woodman today.Even though they look great,I do not see the advantage of them over a 209 primer.I do not see the need to fight to get the primer in the module and then have to take it out.I can just put the primer in the gun,shoot it then take the primer out.I know the need for some one to use them,they are just not for me.
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Post by GMB54-120 on Aug 23, 2022 12:31:11 GMT -5
i used a breech plug for a smoker to do it in a lee hand press . I fashioned a adapter and rod . It wasnt hard to do i thought . Could you Please post a photo of your Set Up? Yeah, pics help understand and its sure not hard to do.
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