Is Sabot a Handicap?

[ET]

From my perspective it is a handicap to performance but not a crippling handicap.
If we understand the factors affecting the sabot, we can in some cases reduce the detrimental factors to produce acceptable performance. I would say heat is the most detrimental factor that alters the physical property characteristic of the sabot. The worst culprit is bore heat being developed from repeated firing. If memory serves me correctly Rossman40 once measured an increase of 4F from firing. In order to reduce the affect of heat we need to allow cooling time for the barrel to return to its original temp. Here a cooling rod can be used to help reduce the cooling time. Keep in mind that temp change can alter some powder burn rates. Another culprit for heating sabots is exposure to direct sunlight especially on a really warm day.

All this info kind of sounds complicate to some but once you begin to understand it, it isn’t that intimidating. Knowing what I need to help keep the sabots performance up to par to produce reasonable accurate groups will produce humane kills and meat on the table.
Now if you don’t want to be bothered with sabot needs then I will be the first to suggest you go sabot-less say in a 45. But also be ready for a different learning curve that comes with this change. There are enough experienced sabot-less shooters here that could help with this transition.

Some may wonder why I haven’t made the transition to sabot-less?
My introduction to SML was with the 10ml-II and with it have gone through the learning curve that has opened my eyes as well as educating me in the art from her response to what I do. I believe I can still learn a little bit more with the 50. I guess we are an inseparable team, chuckle.

Ed

[smokepolehall]

I suppose it could be, but depending on your use it maybe the cats meow. Yes sir temps bore heat n outside heat factor. Once cooler hunting temps arrive i find no problems at all. I have lots of time shooting here at cabin so i let my barrel cool in the shade 30 min between shots. I keep my sabots in cool dry spot & get one each time i need to load up. Rifle range you had best have ice / & cooler n rod to work with

[sw]

Ed,
I’m using sabots in my 45 PacNor/209. All the std loads 58-62 H4198, 10/50, etc have worked well. However, I’ve settled on the anemic load of 37g VV110/200SST/195B and will try the same load with 225g AccuMax sized to fit the HLBS. I use wool wads. Speed is 2350-2500+ depending on 20” or 26” barrel. MOA accuracy. Very low recoil and no observable temp sensitivity. If I were shooting my 50, I’d stay with 44-45 VV110/250 TEZ (or TMZ, which ever, the flat based version).

[ET]

Smokepolehall
For range purpose I just use an aluminum cooling rod about 15minutes between shots seems to work well in moderate warm weather. Thanks for your comment.

SW
Do you find using a wool wad under sabot supports and benefits sabot performance in very warm weather conditions?
In hot weather I tend to shy away from SML shooting at all.
I do enjoy reading about the 45 experience from others. Sometimes a mention can open a different line of thinking. Thanks for your comment.

Ed

[reloader22]

Maybe a handicap in a sub bore.  In a .50 stock Savage, or even a rebarreled pac-nor .50, a sabot is ALMOST the only option for the masses.  Average deer hunters (me) can shoot a 250 gr bullet in a .50 and find very adequate performance and decent real world hunting range.  We can also push heavier bullets that are still light for bore.  Any bore filling bullet in a .50 cal with a really good BC will run 650 gr plus.  Isn't that about the lightest 50 BMG weight?  Yes there are some 350-500 gr brick bullets meant for the 50 S & W for example, but they are very hard to get to shoot well sabotless in a 50, AND what benefit would they have?  Sabots are a God-send to a .50 and not a handi-cap.  

[ET]

Reloader22

All opinions are respected.
If I were to ever try sabotless in the 50 I would only try 1-bullet. Barnes 325xpb-.500"-BC.228.
Now that would be a moose killer load.

Ed

[sw]

Ed,when I started testing with Toby in ‘99-‘00, i was shooting a # of MLs and then ML2s . The earlier short MMPs and longer versions were softer, I think. I just reverted back to wool wads just like I had used under my hotter loaded patched round balls. It’s a habit that’s hard to break plus it allows me to spend 4 - 7 cents more per shot. 😊
I just see it as insurance but realize that with my much gentler, but maybe higher pressure 45 cal loads of up to 37g VV110 (45 cal) .

[ET]

Jul 29, 2019 12:34:41 GMT -5 sw said:

Ed,when I started testing with Toby in ‘99-‘00, i was shooting a # of MLs and then ML2s . The earlier short MMPs and longer versions were softer, I think. I just reverted back to wool wads just like I had used under my hotter loaded patched round balls. It’s a habit that’s hard to break plus it allows me to spend 4 - 7 cents more per shot. 😊
I just see it as insurance but realize that with my much gentler, but maybe higher pressure 45 cal loads of up to 37g VV110 (45 cal) .

WOW, 4-7 additional cents per shot, just kidding. Using Harvester sabots with a tapered base and compressing my powder load the addition of a wool wad may be beneficial in very warm weather. From my perspective when MMP sabots produced a sub base it didn't do anything to help performance in warmer weather. Wool wad is something I now feel I have to try. In cooler weather I have no issues with Harvester sabots. The black harvester sabot performs so well I don't use any other sabot and will knurl my bullets for desired fit. I've just about got everything organized for some interesting outings but the hot weather and work scheduling has put a damper on activity for the moment.
Thanks for responding to my query.

Ed

[mrbuck]

I have also found the MMP Sub-Base not of any great help with the MMP Sabots in my MLIIs . Using wool wads may be the answer to my 16+ year accuracy quest ! ? ! Dry or lubed ?
Chris

[sw]

I use them in cold and hot wx with the thought of changing nothing that could change performance.
I’ve used both. Currently the non-lub’d Montana. I like the All Day Wonder wads with the dry lubricant. The MMP sub bases seemed like a good idea, but didn’t seem to help.

[jims]

I agree the sub bases never were a help in my shooting.

[GMB54-120]

.060 x.463 poly wads ($20/1000)....Buffalo Arms has a 50cal .512 version also. I have not tried them with smokeless yet by they appear to be very tough. They also sell .135 x .460 Circle Fly Nitro Cards. ($7.50/500)