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Post by bestill on Mar 14, 2017 7:53:44 GMT -5
Custom Omega II Got chance to test new Omega build Saturday. Focus was comparing asg 209 breech plug vs hybrid lrmp module with 209 style flame channel. Wasnt focused on accuracy. Mainly velocity and deviation. 26 degrees while tested. Smooth form loose with no wad. Also tested a new 700ml build with asg 209 system and hybrid lrmp system with fullform and light blackhorn load. Same focus velocity and deviation and ignition. Not accuracy. loose bullets and blackhorn is tricky to ignite. All were instant boom. I have a cheap caldwell chronograph but conclusion both ignitions were 100% seal and went boom
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Post by edge on Mar 14, 2017 8:09:20 GMT -5
Very cool, that's a lot of shooting Just curious as to your cleaning, whether between shots, between groups or after shooting...especially interested in your cleaning BH209? thanks, edge.
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Post by bestill on Mar 14, 2017 8:13:59 GMT -5
Shot 5 shots before test with Omega to get fouled with Smokeless then 2 shots between ignition change.
Blackhorn was cleaned between every shot. Hoppes 9 mixed 50/50 with 91% alcohol. 1 damp patch and 2 dry patches
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Post by eml9 on Mar 14, 2017 8:35:38 GMT -5
Very good test and info.. thank you
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Post by edge on Mar 14, 2017 9:05:42 GMT -5
Thanks, by the way for not being an accuracy test I'd be very happy with the results anyday edge.
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Post by lwh723 on Mar 14, 2017 9:10:41 GMT -5
Very interesting. Thanks for taking the time to document. Looks like the LRMP with less flame volume is handicapped by the longer flame channel. Most of the feedback I'm getting from customers comparing ASG209 plug to full recessed ASG LRMP plug is the LRMP is yielding more speed in the same barrel.
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Post by GMB54-120 on Mar 14, 2017 9:47:20 GMT -5
Very interesting. Thanks for taking the time to document. Looks like the LRMP with less flame volume is handicapped by the longer flame channel. Most of the feedback I'm getting from customers comparing ASG209 plug to full recessed ASG LRMP plug is the LRMP is yielding more speed in the same barrel. That same thought appears to also be true for a shorter or at least more efficient 209 plug. Its just much harder to get a 209 to hold up to the additional pressure it may create. A 209 module system is about the easiest way i can think of to test this theory in the same rifle.
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Post by lwh723 on Mar 14, 2017 10:26:49 GMT -5
Very interesting. Thanks for taking the time to document. Looks like the LRMP with less flame volume is handicapped by the longer flame channel. Most of the feedback I'm getting from customers comparing ASG209 plug to full recessed ASG LRMP plug is the LRMP is yielding more speed in the same barrel. That same thought appears to also be true for a shorter or at least more efficient 209 plug. Its just much harder to get a 209 to hold up to the additional pressure it may create. A 209 module system is about the easiest way i can think of to test this theory in the same rifle. Fair point. And I actually have a sketch of how to make a 209 module and modify an ASG LRMP plug for just such an experiment. But it's pretty low on the priority list to spend any effort on for me. I think if you're going through the trouble of modules it might as well be LRMP in my opinion. If one of the tinkers here wants to try I'll donate a plug and the drawings.
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Post by Earnhardt on Mar 14, 2017 10:47:52 GMT -5
Bushing orifice size?
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Post by rpcw on Mar 14, 2017 11:10:24 GMT -5
Great test and thanks for posting it!
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Post by bestill on Mar 14, 2017 11:26:36 GMT -5
Asg 209. 3/8 x .030 Hybrid lrmp .250 x .040 Both rifles
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Post by schunter on Mar 14, 2017 12:28:16 GMT -5
Great test and thanks for the info. No veggie wad on the full form with blackhorn?
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Post by bestill on Mar 14, 2017 14:11:44 GMT -5
Great test and thanks for the info. No veggie wad on the full form with blackhorn? Correct no wad fullform
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Post by 7mmfreak on Mar 14, 2017 14:19:44 GMT -5
Great job. Mirrors my experience like I told you the other day. LRMP needs a really short path and larger vent.
I agree with Luke that if you are going to use modules then LRMP is the way to go but there are absolutely no flies on 209 as the gun I just built my dad has single digit ES over 10-shots and is faster with the same charge than my LRMP was (RIP).
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Post by mcgowen45 on Mar 14, 2017 18:47:35 GMT -5
Great test Jeff. The speeds and ES are real close, and even thought you did not test for accuracy, it was there. I have sued both systems, and I really can tell much difference between the, but I love the Hybrid plug on my 40 cal. Will test some more when the weather gets better.
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Post by lwh723 on Mar 14, 2017 22:15:09 GMT -5
For the fun of it, I went ahead and did a little number crunching on the data. Nothing really earth shattering. When it gets right down too it, both methods were pretty similar as far as consistency goes. Really the only major outlier was the 2165 FPS shot that the LRMP threw with BH209. Here's the BH209 with "flyer" LRMP shot removed. Data becomes very comparable. But in real life you don't always get to pick your best 9 (or 3 ).
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Post by Earnhardt on Mar 14, 2017 22:38:09 GMT -5
Luke, what size bushing orifice in your tests?
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Post by bestill on Mar 15, 2017 0:21:47 GMT -5
Asg 209. 3/8 x .030 Hybrid lrmp .250 x .040 Both rifles
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Post by lwh723 on Mar 15, 2017 5:57:44 GMT -5
Luke, what size bushing orifice in your tests? This is just Bestill's data regurgitated .
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Post by rambler on Mar 15, 2017 7:49:17 GMT -5
Interesting testing. Thanks for putting this info out here.
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Post by edge on Mar 15, 2017 8:51:58 GMT -5
IMO, the main question is why the outlier, not that it existed!
It may have been for a whole lot of reasons, like chrono related, sizing related, fouling related, etc.
OR
It may actually be a result of the reason for the test...Primer Related ( LRMP vs 209 ).
The only place the outlier occurred was with the LRMP with the harder to ignite powder which may OR MAY NOT be significant.
It would be interesting to see if in a side by side test with a much slower smokeless powder there were outliers with one primer vs the other primer ( but I am certainly not asking anyone to do this ).
edge.
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Post by bestill on Mar 15, 2017 10:40:04 GMT -5
One variable i think has a huge effect is handling recoil i can bump velocity with a hard hold. These were all shot free recoil in bags. So could have been trigger man. I did 10 shots to pull a fair avg.
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Post by gendoc on Mar 15, 2017 16:54:05 GMT -5
Great test and thanks for posting it! X2, thanks Jeff !!
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