New to Me Savage ML II

[josmund]

Thought I'd dip my toe in the smokeless game as I've just purchased an ML II ( Stainless / Camo ). I have a great deal of experience with BP and all the subs. I also reload for several CF calibers.

Everything I read here is all about the conversion to 45s. Is that just because this board is dedicated to conversions or because a stock gun won't shoot?

Any tips or threads for a newb? I will carefully review the owners manual prior to usage.

[mtj555]

Congrats on your new SML. Most people have converted to .45 because they are shooting sabotless to get away from the weak link-sabot. This is not to say that you can't get a stock savage to shoot very well. My savage still has the factory barrel. However I had Richard do a bedding job and add a thumb screw so I can remove the bolt without having to loosen the action. It's very accurate if I do my part. I would stick with .458 bullets and find the right bullet sabot combo for your barrel. If you can find N120 it works very well for me. I use 60 grains N120, Barnes original 300 grain .458 semi spitzer bullet in a harvester black crush rib sabot with Fed 209a primer and it shoots .5 MOA. You just need to let the barrel cool down between shots. Heat is a big killer of sabots. Some members here shooting sabots are using cooling rods to cool the barrel between shots. If you find N120 somewhere between 58-60 grains should yield good results for you with a good fitting bullet/sabot

[zalexander]

I have a stock savage 50 cal and it shoots just fine. I use N-110 and hornady XTP 250gr bullets and it will shoot 1 MOA.

[Richard]

The average deer hunter, hunting at reasonable ranges, will be satisfied with the ML II in .50 cal shooting as descrebed by mtj555.. IF, you are interested on doing better than that and extending ranges out beyond 250 to 300 yards, then you would probably want to simply switch to a .45 barrel..........a simple swap. Unscrew the .50 and screw on a pre-threaded .45 and head space (also simple). Like was mentioned, heat is a problem with any saboted loads. The sabot gets soft and the pressure blows by and you loose velocity/accuracy.......commonly referred to as a "blown sabot" The problem with going sabot less in a .50 is the lack of bullets. With the .45 you can use .458" bullets run thru a full forming die which imprints rifling on the bullet OR, you can use the .452 variety and smooth size them for an interference fit. Either way, no sabot is used. Results are kind of split on which shoots better..............full formed or smooth. Both have been know to shoot 1/2 MOA with the right load and trigger puller.
The board was formed primarily for the .50 but experimentation by board members gradually caused many to migrate over to the .45 for the above reasons. Many deer have fallen to the .50 and still will in the future. The .45 is just another avenue of increased accuracy for the bug-hole shooters!

Richard

[josmund]

Thanks Guys,

Good Information.

[10ga]

Have 2 MLII in 50 and they shoot plenty good. Just a bit of tricking out and load developement and they shoot plenty good. Bedded, polished bore, .458 bullest of 300 grains, sabot to fit,(orange for 1 and BCR for other) and moderate loads. They do moa+ if I do my part. Have plenty fun hunting all season and no cleaning stinky guns or corrosion or FTF. Lots of 50 guys out here. SML is way better then black/sub shooting. JMHO, 10 ga

[GMB54-120]

Reloder7 is still pretty widely available and IMO a very good powder for "starters" that want to shoot 300-325gr bullets. Low pressure and easy to ignite. 60-63gr is semi mild but still beats typical BH209 speeds. Slightly dirty but no worse than BH209.

Hornady .458 325gr FTX is a very good affordable bullet. It will have no problems expanding in deer and making 2 holes nearly every time. MMP Orange sabot or Harvester Black Crushrib depending on what fits your best.

This combo seems to be pretty good in quite a few Savage 50cals with some room to spare on the upper end. Its about as easy as it gets on vents and sabots while maintaining good reliability.

[josmund]

Thanks Guys,

FYI I have Varget, Hogden H335 and IMR 4831 on the shelf. Any thoughts on these powders.

I see the Savage manual only list 3 powders and I believe only the 250 bullet for the 10 ML. I'm used to my CF with a dozen or more published and safe loads.

I have another question if I may. Does the sabot serve as a escape hatch for a too hot load? Not that I plan on going there but if it were to be a little hot, I would think it would be the first to go.

[superkirby]

In general, I think if a load is hot enough to blow up a barrel, it's not something a sabot is going to save. If you're blowing up a barrel, you have 2 charges, 2 bullets, or both. I believe the Savage barrel was safely tested up to 125k PSI, way hotter than anything you're shoulder will take. If you use safe loading practices, you'll be ok. If you double load, no amount of barrel strength will save you.
As for powder, and there's a lot of smarter people here than me that I'm sure will chime in, but the book loads are safe and will go bang pretty easily. Look at TG's pressure trace list. There's hundreds of loads in there. Most are for .45's, but there's some in there for .50's. Basically, depending on how easily a powder is ignited, you may have to get into duplexing with a faster booster and a slower main charge. I'll leave it there as I have no experience with duplexing.
When I had my .50 SMI/Encore, I had real good luck with 300 gr. bullets and Re7.
Good luck, be careful, and you'll have fun.

[Deleted]

May 25, 2015 17:46:58 GMT -5 josmund said:

Thought I'd dip my toe in the smokeless game as I've just purchased an ML II ( Stainless / Camo ). I have a great deal of experience with BP and all the subs. I also reload for several CF calibers.

Everything I read here is all about the conversion to 45s. Is that just because this board is dedicated to conversions or because a stock gun won't shoot?

Any tips or threads for a newb? I will carefully review the owners manual prior to usage.

Send Dave W a PM, he isn't on much but I'm sure he will eventually get back to you. He has shot an immense amount of loads out of the 50 cal Savage, IIRC his load count out of his Savage is in the thousands. He will be a great resource to help you answer some questions and maybe save you some grief. Not that these other guys can't help, not saying that at all, there's a lot of experience here with the Savage's.

[Dave W]

Those powders are pretty slow for a .50 cal. All would likely need duplexed or very heavy bullets to be used as a single.