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Post by dave d. on May 6, 2013 17:50:16 GMT -5
:)wow dane great work and great shooting thanks. Maybe if you get a moment you could explain your brass prep procedure and measure that vent hole size.
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Post by dave d. on May 6, 2013 17:55:48 GMT -5
:)ooh btw pete will be making 15 to 20 in a couple of weeks.
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Post by moto357 on May 6, 2013 20:32:55 GMT -5
The brass I've tried has all been fired prior to cutting for this. I found unsized the brass seems too large to fit. New unsized brass fit real loose but when sized with any full length sizer the fit feels perfect. Once fired out of this breech plug I found no need to resize as they fit just the same for every subsequent shot with the same brass.
Dave, I "tossed" the vent but I'll take a quick look for it. Now I'm curious too what it actually was
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Post by dave d. on May 7, 2013 5:54:53 GMT -5
:)thanks dane hope you can find it.
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Post by moto357 on May 7, 2013 17:56:37 GMT -5
After talking with Dave, next time out I'll shoot the and see what kind of accuracy loss will be seen and at what vent size. Think what I'll do is shoot a number of groups all with the same load. After 20 I'll check the vent, if accuracy is good I'll check again at 30. I'm fairly sure it'll be excessively oversize by most peoples standards by that point...
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Post by dave d. on May 7, 2013 20:06:53 GMT -5
:)great can't wait to hear the results. Have fun
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Post by moto357 on May 16, 2013 23:34:07 GMT -5
Made it to the range for a shot trip yesterday, haven't had time to post anything until tonight. temp was in the 50's and gusty winds. Had an issue again with the chrony, tried new battery and cleaned the lenses to no avail. might be time for a newbie... For this trip I wanted to "watch" accuracy fall off as the vent opened or how it would be affected with this different bp. So to do this I would shoot 5 then move to a fresh target. Load was 72gr H4198 .030 veg wad and 300xtp. TG traced a similar load in 23c on the page with all his traces. After seeing his load I'm guessing the load I'm shooting is around 43kpsi? Not the highest when looking for vent wear as well breach plug/brass wear, but it shot good last time out so thought it would be a good one to stick with for now. Same vent liner I shot my last 5 shot group with last time out, so first 5 shots were 6-10 on that vent. Next 5, although load 3 went in too easy, not enough knurling on the bullet. This load had a hang-fire and its the lone bullet hole on the next target down! Last 5 shots and I experienced the same thing as the last group. My knurling abilities are lacking apparently or maybe its a coincidence that I've found a couple undersized? Anyways, this is 4 of the 5 with the other being a hangfire and missing the target completely. Plug is still doing its job and I'm not seeing any blowback worth mentioning. After these 20 shots on the vent liner it measured right at .035. Honestly not as bad as I thought it might be. Anything I may have missed feel free to ask. I wouldn't mind shooting more on this same vent just to see what direction accuracy goes just for curiosity reasons.
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Post by willbird on May 17, 2013 6:37:21 GMT -5
What is the length the cartridge case is cut back to ?? Is there any difficulty inserting the case into the Breech Plug ?
Bill
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Post by moto357 on May 17, 2013 8:26:23 GMT -5
The length of the cartridges are determined by the head space of each specific gun. Mine for a tight fit based on length alone needs to be right at .450. I've used cases .010 shorter and found they sealed just as good for me even at lower saboted shooting pressures. Those results were mentioned in my previous posts. There is no difficulty getting the case into the plug. Using a new unfired case cut down it was loose while a fired case (unsized) was too tight. If I deprime using a full length sizer they fit snug but without any unwanted force. Just like I think they should
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Post by willbird on May 17, 2013 9:37:27 GMT -5
I am drawing up a simpler plug, may give this a shot first, ran a 45 acp case into a 308 die for grins yesterday. Not a lot of taper there really.....considering what Edge mentioned about trying to seal up on a taper vs a case mouth.
I have the luxury of fitting the barrel to the brass :-) if I so desire :-).
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Post by willbird on May 17, 2013 10:38:49 GMT -5
I did a sketch to see how a Fishhawk bushing might fit in there from rough dimensions. It looks like it will fit ??
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Post by edge on May 17, 2013 11:09:05 GMT -5
SNIP. ran a 45 acp case into a 308 die for grins yesterday. Not a lot of taper there really.....considering what Edge mentioned about trying to seal up on a taper vs a case mouth. SNIP. Not sure what your point is? There is about 0.007 of taper vs about 0.002 on an acp case. If you bore the correct taper you will get a better seal unless your cut cases are perfect, but you probably already knew that edge.
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Post by willbird on May 17, 2013 11:27:49 GMT -5
SNIP. ran a 45 acp case into a 308 die for grins yesterday. Not a lot of taper there really.....considering what Edge mentioned about trying to seal up on a taper vs a case mouth. SNIP. Not sure what your point is? There is about 0.007 of taper vs about 0.002 on an acp case. If you bore the correct taper you will get a better seal unless your cut cases are perfect, but you probably already knew that edge. Yup about .008 measuring a case .720 long, which is longer than we are talking about, and yes a bored taper will probably be a good idea. Point is just wild meandering of a deranged mind probably :-). Ran it up into a 22-250 die and got .02 taper again at .720 long...one of the meanderings of the deranged mind is that taper might help in getting the case into there with cold fingers...when deer are watching you reload...stuff like that :-). Looks like about .01" at .450 length measuring to a caliper scribe line :-). That amount of taper gives a lot more wiggle room to get it started.
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Post by edge on May 17, 2013 12:18:24 GMT -5
Gotcha, my cases are trimmed to 0.890 long and I push feed the cases from the magazine so a bit of taper helps to enter the BP too.
edge.
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Post by dave d. on May 17, 2013 13:34:54 GMT -5
dane my cases are around .450 also. Keep shooting buddy looks like you are having some fun. I talked to pete and he would probably make some without the taper on the powder side for guys that want a bushing. I dont think its necessary but that was nice of him to possibly offer it that way. Anyway looks like we have a winner. Look forward to further reports dane.
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Post by willbird on May 17, 2013 22:32:13 GMT -5
dane my cases are around .450 also. Keep shooting buddy looks like you are having some fun. I talked to pete and he would probably make some without the taper on the powder side for guys that want a bushing. I dont think its necessary but that was nice of him to possibly offer it that way. Anyway looks like we have a winner. Look forward to further reports dane. I figure worst case the bushing just lasts forever :-). Bill
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Post by juanvaldez on Oct 12, 2016 4:07:01 GMT -5
great plug....who can I buy one from?
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Post by kash913 on Oct 12, 2016 10:14:24 GMT -5
Great design very interesting
Look like sealing in the front shoulder you don't have to worry about gas counting leaking around the threads?
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Post by bigwoods on Oct 12, 2016 12:14:42 GMT -5
I see the initial posts were from 2013. Did it fall off the popularity wagon? I havent saw it used much in the last couple years.
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Post by spc136 on Oct 13, 2016 9:44:57 GMT -5
Am I understanding this correctly. You have to trim cases . Then do you have to resize brass ? Also change vent every 20 to 30 shots ? What is the advantage to this system ?
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Post by edge on Oct 13, 2016 10:06:22 GMT -5
Am I understanding this correctly. You have to trim cases . Then do you have to resize brass ? Also change vent every 20 to 30 shots ? What is the advantage to this system ? The case trim is how you headspace! I don't think there is any need to size your cases with this plug unless your cases are grossly oversize. A vent liner is a disposable item but if you use a bushing it will last a very long time. edge. PS you are replying to a very old post
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Post by spc136 on Oct 13, 2016 12:42:39 GMT -5
Ok I'm understanding better now .
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Post by ourway77 on Oct 14, 2016 8:08:25 GMT -5
Read and reread this post numerous times I have a Remington 700 UML that in time I want to convert. With your new plug can one use 45 win mag brass or the Remington UML brass? Maybe I missed it but how is the brass loaded into the breech plug? similar to the UML? OK when your plug is available who could I get to do the installation of the plug in a stock Brux barrel and fitted to the action. Not too savvy between the ears when it comes to all this technical jargen. I was going to send it away and wait 9 months for only one reason to use large rifle magnum primers. Thanks Lou
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Post by edge on Oct 14, 2016 8:19:58 GMT -5
This is for a centerfire action, you remove the ejector pin and insert the brass into the boltface.
edge.
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Post by tbye3300 on Oct 14, 2016 22:22:22 GMT -5
Am I understanding this correctly. You have to trim cases . Then do you have to resize brass ? Also change vent every 20 to 30 shots ? What is the advantage to this system ? The case trim is how you headspace! I don't think there is any need to size your cases with this plug unless your cases are grossly oversize. A vent liner is a disposable item but if you use a bushing it will last a very long time. edge. PS you are replying to a very old post I use this plug and have good luck with it. I Turned out some of my own brass modules on the lathe to fit perfect. I've been happy with it.
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Post by leighclambakes on Nov 5, 2019 19:41:00 GMT -5
So I know this thread is long past it's due, but I'm not seeing the continuation elsewhere on this topic. I just purchased a hardly used Remington 700 UML, and would like to purchase this breechplug to use with BH209. I managed to back into a deal on a BAWS Remington 700 SA (cf) smokeless conversion, and it uses cut down .473 cases like your system does. I don't think this breechplug and the BAWS plug will use the same brass module, but it would be an awful lot closer than the Remmy Ultimate modules are.
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Post by Boonechaser on Nov 15, 2019 19:24:51 GMT -5
So I know this thread is long past it's due, but I'm not seeing the continuation elsewhere on this topic. I just purchased a hardly used Remington 700 UML, and would like to purchase this breechplug to use with BH209. I managed to back into a deal on a BAWS Remington 700 SA (cf) smokeless conversion, and it uses cut down .473 cases like your system does. I don't think this breechplug and the BAWS plug will use the same brass module, but it would be an awful lot closer than the Remmy Ultimate modules are. No continuation is because things were always evolving at that time and better option have become available. May want to check this replacement plug and modules out. If I had an Ultimate, this is the route I would go for using BH209 www.arrowheadrifles.com/product/uml_replacement_plug/
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