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Post by rbinar on Mar 18, 2009 19:18:56 GMT -5
8-)I made my frist reply from the post's title thread. Afterward I read the secondary posts and it sounds to me like bedding is a bigger problem than it should be.
That's why JB weld has been my only choice. For one thing it's a two part epoxy colored black and white. You don't have to pour it in a cup to measure just squeeze it on to any flat surface. Anyone can tell if you have half one and half the other in an instant.
Another thing is mixing: Accu-glass says mix for two minutes. I'd follow that advice since you can't tell whats happening by sight. JB weld turns from two colors to one gray while mixing. You can see with your own eyes when it's mixed completely.
Some of the glass products run like water or require external solids to thicken. JB weld is the perfect consistency when mixed and can be put directly to the stock without anything added. It's firm enough where you can raise or lower the muzzle and not worry about spills. Seldom would you have to dam for contact and if so it takes very little clay. It also has a fairly long working time so if you mess up you have time to clean it off.
The only disadvantage I've seen is it's so strong when cured if it gets on the screw and front pillar it will tear the old bonding out of the pillar and the pillar will come out with the screw. However that's not so terrible because now you can reinstall it with JB weld and it won't come out a second time.
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Post by joe21a on Mar 19, 2009 8:31:44 GMT -5
I have done many stocks with JB weld, and I like it much better than the more expensive bedding products. You do need to be real careful and use plenty of release agent. I buy it in the 5 oz tube and always have a couple new one in the fridge.
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Post by songdog on Mar 19, 2009 19:45:27 GMT -5
Question for you all. I have used JB Weld in the past, BUT, I only used it to PERMANENTLY attach two items together. Which it does VERY WELL!!! And in my experience it always seemed to be very quick in setting up! So how is it that you can use it to bed a barrel? Again, my experience has been in attaching things and I just don't know that I would get the working time before complete setup of the glues! And what would be the best way to install the "third" pillar in a synthetic stock so I don't have to worry about losing POI when removing the breech plug. I have read some of the previous posts, but I would like to know of the best current instructions for installing the third pillar. Thanks for all of your help, AND, for the vast amount of information you all are so willing to share!!!
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Post by rossman40 on Mar 20, 2009 0:08:42 GMT -5
Probly the big difference between Devcon putty, Marine Tex and JB Weld is the work time. With Devcon you have an hour, JB weld 30 minutes. Actually to be on the safe side for the best work time cut both times by a 1/3. Marine Tex is about the fastest and starts setting up in about 20 minutes, even less if it's thick. If you got everything laid out, your dams in place and everything ready to go, 20 minutes is more then enough time.
As far as the third pillar we have covered it in other threads and you can do it fairly easy if you have access to at least a decent drill press. As far as the pillars I've only done it on laminate stocks and I cut my own mushroom head pillars much like the front.
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Post by youp50 on Mar 20, 2009 3:19:33 GMT -5
If you use Devcon be sure you know which product you want, they make many types. In industry, I have used a Devcon product that cures like a hockey puck rubber and another that seals high pressure steam cuts in a flange. The rubber stuff is popular with guys who have worn the leather off the steel toes on their boots.
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Post by rbinar on Mar 20, 2009 4:56:46 GMT -5
8-)It sounds like you're using the quick set JB weld. The regular JB weld won't set in three hours let alone 30 minutes if the temperature isn't really hot.
In fact I watch a few hours into cure because you can find a point where it's semi solid and at that point you can peel it off with ease. This makes clean up much easier if you have over run.
As one commentor said the only draw back is use plenty of release. Once JB weld is dry the only choice for removal is to grind it off and it sticks equally well to metal as to wood.
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Post by rbinar on Mar 20, 2009 5:18:29 GMT -5
And what would be the best way to install the "third" pillar in a synthetic stock so I don't have to worry about losing POI when removing the breech plug. I have read some of the previous posts, but I would like to know of the best current instructions for installing the third pillar. Thanks for all of your help, AND, for the vast amount of information you all are so willing to share!!! I don't like bedding plastic stocks (take too long) but they can be done permanently with some effort. I fill the blind magazine with something lightweight such as wood or light plastic blocks. Then I cut some wire braces from a coat hangar and wedge the wire into the side panels of the false magazine. This will keep every thing in place even if the bedding won't hold well on the plastic. I don't use JB weld to fill the magazine you need something that will pour into the opening. A third pillar can then be drilled into the filled magazine and JB welded in place. I generally use a small piece of aluminum scrap on the magazine floor (you should too) to give the third pillar screw a solid to pull against if the third pillar is used. After the false magazine is filled rough it up with a Dremel and bed as if it were any other rifle stock. There are a number of tricks to the trade. For instance I generally drill a centered pilot hole for the pillar. I then make a drill bushing by boring a .210" hole into a piece of metal (choice of type not critical) that's the same size as the pilot hole. By using this bushing I can drill and tap a hole in the receiver that is centered in the receiver and pillar.
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Post by jims on Mar 21, 2009 22:31:28 GMT -5
I tried the JB Weld on Thurday. It seemed to work well. I made it more difficult though, I got some of the Weld on the action screws. I do not use tubing or tape to hold the action down. This time I also put the ML bolt in also, don't ask me why, I have never done that before. Anyways the action comes out of the stock nicely, the ML bolt will not come out of the action. After trying for quite awhile I was able to lift the bolt partways. I figured I got some JB Weld through the action screw holes and when they were snugged down some got on the ML bolt and when the Weld dried the clearances were too tight to permit the ML bolt removal. Freezing did not help so I lightly heated the bolt in the suspect area. Voila. I was able to get the ML bolt to cam OK and was able to remove it. As suspected there was some JB Weld there. My bad, the product itself worked as described. I cleaned out the film/residue and to be safe took the Snap On tap and die to the needed areas and everything now works fine. Just an explanation on how not to do it. I have bedded over 10 stocks and really never deviated from a set procedure, I did this time and it made for more than an interesting evening.
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Post by rbinar on Mar 22, 2009 7:49:16 GMT -5
I tried the JB Weld on Thurday. It seemed to work well. I made it more difficult though, I got some of the Weld on the action screws. I do not use tubing or tape to hold the action down. This time I also put the ML bolt in also, don't ask me why, I have never done that before. Anyways the action comes out of the stock nicely, the ML bolt will not come out of the action. After trying for quite awhile I was able to lift the bolt partways. I figured I got some JB Weld through the action screw holes and when they were snugged down some got on the ML bolt and when the Weld dried the clearances were too tight to permit the ML bolt removal. Freezing did not help so I lightly heated the bolt in the suspect area. Voila. I was able to get the ML bolt to cam OK and was able to remove it. As suspected there was some JB Weld there. My bad, the product itself worked as described. I cleaned out the film/residue and to be safe took the Snap On tap and die to the needed areas and everything now works fine. Just an explanation on how not to do it. I have bedded over 10 stocks and really never deviated from a set procedure, I did this time and it made for more than an interesting evening. I don't remember trying to bed an action with the bolt in. Now you've told me what happens I won't be tempted. JB weld is not quite liquid when applied. So rather then run down the action it is pressed out and occasionally up. One of the "tricks of the trade" when using is don't get it bunched up at the receiver screws. Then the screws will engage the action before it can be pushed into the holes. If you also spray the inside of the action, screw threads and especially the inside of the pillars with release agent then even if it gets in the action it won't be hard to break. Like everything you can't know what is going to happen without trying it. With a little care the first time won't be a disaster and any additional attempts will only emphasize it's advantages.
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