Finally Range Time

[ET]

Okay got a good lesson with 4227 and Savage BP. Not even a poof when fired, yet in a recessed BP it goes off like a roman candle. 4227 requires a hot ignition that the standard Savage BP does not provide. No fun tearing apart to remove the load at the range.

Now I happened to have some 75gr 4198 loads on hand. Now this load has a shoulder kicking attitude but controllable. I know I’m not on the sweet spot but believe a good group can be had. Anyway, Reloader22 I kept my word.




As for the digital infrared thermometer it works like a charm. It easily distinguished the difference between bore temp and outside barrel temp. No more guessing at bore temp and length of waiting time.

Ambient temp was 84F and no sabot failure issues. When I’m not pressed for time, I still want to try a wad and see what it does.

I managed to acquire a 1lb bottle of Reloder7 so my next round will be Reloder7 and 3/8” recessed BP.
I’m really itching to give this a go.

[jims]

Glad to see you are back at it.

[ET]

Yes, it was nice to be back at the range but this might be short lived as the second wave of Covid19 is coming on strong and the Province is considering of going back to lock down.
My chronograph is still not properly responding and will probably send it in over the winter for repair. But I still can monitor load pressure characteristics for given loads. I’ve never had so many obstacles to deal with for a given project but I’ll just keep pecking away at it when the opportunity presents itself.

What is coming to light is how different variables really affect a load. Find the right combination and you have a winning load.

[billc]

I hope your project progresses without too many hick-ups.

[ET]

Sept 24, 2020 15:49:15 GMT -5 billc said:

I hope your project progresses without too many hick-ups.

So do I, so do I.

[dannoboone]

Yup, there's just too many good, reliable powders out there
which negate fooling around with 4227, especially with the
Savage plug. It could be set off by duplexing, but why bother?
It could also possibly be set off using heavier bullets, but
again, why bother?

I tried it once with a 250gr bullet and vowed NEVER AGAIN
after cleaning the mess out of my 10MLII!

[ET]

Sept 25, 2020 12:48:50 GMT -5 dannoboone said:

Yup, there's just too many good, reliable powders out there
which negate fooling around with 4227, especially with the
Savage plug. It could be set off by duplexing, but why bother?
It could also possibly be set off using heavier bullets, but
again, why bother?

I tried it once with a 250gr bullet and vowed NEVER AGAIN
after cleaning the mess out of my 10MLII!

No argument from me on 4227 and standard Savage Plug and 250gr bullet.
Now 4227 is still quite usable in a recessed BP producing excellent results.
So I will keep 4227 on hand. Also I'm not finished testing usage of 4227.

[ET]

Just a quick follow-up on my last range visit with PT.
You can obviously see what happens when you change the load resistance. In this case 5lbs LR change equates to a 5K pressure change. Of course, that increases velocity that can be seen on the target even though I don’t have a working chronograph at the moment.
For future testing I plan to try and keep the load resistance just slightly over 20LBs which should be doable by other shooters. To me the load resistance is a key element for a good load.

Knowing the Rise Time found with slower powders and Savage BP gives me a reference point for observing the benefit of a recessed BP. If I can bring the Rise Time down to a certain level then IMO overall load performance should improve even more.
For me doing PT testing is slow going and can only imagine the time TG invested in testing.

So far, no sabot issues in warmer temps which is a good sign. Now that’s with a slower rise time but what will happen when I quicken the rise time and increase peak pressure? Another observation to keep in mind.

I don’t for-see an issue with getting a 250gr bullet up to 2800fps But I now have a lurking question in the back of my mind. Can even more velocity be safely obtained? Not that I would use it but if I’m seeking to unlock more potential with the 10ml-II I will need to explore all avenues.

It will be some time before I lose interest with exploring 10ML-II potential.

[reloader22]

I have pushed 185 gr XTP's 3150 fps  (Just to see if it could be done as this bullet at that speed is useless unless exploding a woodchuck at 50 yds) with a duplex and 250's 2900 fps with 80 gr of H4198.  Glad you are having the same experience as me using 4198 in large doses.  I have never experienced sabot failure.  even when shooting 3 shot groups on warm days.  Is it the powder, is it my particular barrel?  Is it the 250 barnes with the supplied sabot?  Don't know.  I do know that 2 deer fell to the 250 TMZ at 2900 fps both under 100 yds and they were very dead, little blown up meat, and full pass thru would you believe.  LOL.

How are you adjusting load resistance when using sabots?

[ET]

Sept 26, 2020 10:12:53 GMT -5 reloader22 said:

I have pushed 185 gr XTP's 3150 fps  (Just to see if it could be done as this bullet at that speed is useless unless exploding a woodchuck at 50 yds) with a duplex and 250's 2900 fps with 80 gr of H4198.  Glad you are having the same experience as me using 4198 in large doses.  I have never experienced sabot failure.  even when shooting 3 shot groups on warm days.  Is it the powder, is it my particular barrel?  Is it the 250 barnes with the supplied sabot?  Don't know.  I do know that 2 deer fell to the 250 TMZ at 2900 fps both under 100 yds and they were very dead, little blown up meat, and full pass thru would you believe.  LOL.

How are you adjusting load resistance when using sabots?

First thanks for info on 250 velocity and resulting meat damage as I’m a meat hunter to begin with.
Hey if you want velocity it appears large doses of powder are needed. In my case if more velocity than 2800fps is needed to find the sweet spot then so be it. This will definitely be assigned as a hunting load.
With this velocity it would even make a good moose load.
My introduction to “Socket To Me” world of recoil.

As to your question about load resistance control, I do this with one type of sabot and knurl the bullets to different diameters. This is why I include this info with my traces. When temps begin to drop and sabot firms up my lesser diameter will produce the load resistance I want. I easily keep different diameter bullets on hand stored in the old Hornady plastic cases that keeps this neatly organized.



As for lighter bullets well I’m not there yet but look forward to eventually arriving there.

[reloader22]

Just to be clear about the meat damage:   There was hardly any.  To qualify further, both deer were perfectly broad side and hit top of the heart, bottom of lungs.  I would imagine a shoulder/spine shot would jellify the shoulder meat like any bullet being big and fast does 

[ET]

Sept 27, 2020 5:24:14 GMT -5 reloader22 said:

Just to be clear about the meat damage:   There was hardly any.  To qualify further, both deer were perfectly broad side and hit top of the heart, bottom of lungs.  I would imagine a shoulder/spine shot would jellify the shoulder meat like any bullet being big and fast does 

Boiler room shots are also my first choice.
Even a shoulder blade hit with say a 250 bullet going at 2300fps can cause meat loss. To me some meat loss as compared to having a cripple on my hands I consider an acceptable loss.

[jims]

If one cripples a deer and it cannot be found there is total meat loss.

[quillen52]

What sabot are you using?

[ET]

Sept 29, 2020 7:52:00 GMT -5 quillen52 said:

What sabot are you using?

Harvester sabot. I try to incorporate load particulars in red on the PT trace for reference.

[quillen52]

Thanks.