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Savage Muzzleloading Message Board
"The Internet's First Message Board For the Savage Muzzleloader" Since December, 4 2000 This forum is dedicated exclusively for the discussion of the Savage Muzzleloader. This message board is not affiliated with Savage Arms. Please note that any loads used that are not in the Savage owner's manual are used at the owner's own risk, this forum's owner will not be held liable for any damage to equipment from using said loads. DO NOT USE SMOKELESS POWDER IN ANY MUZZLELOADER OTHER THAN THE SAVAGE
I bought a savage 10ml II when they first came out. The gun shot best with the SR powder that is no longer available. I have shot 5744 for a long time with acceptabke groups for the hunting that I do with most shots inside of 100 yards. This year I decided to try different powders and bullets to find a load that the gun really likes. After some research I bought some N120 and Reloader 7 to try with .458 ssts and xtps along with orange MMP and orange Harvester sabots. It turns out that the gun really likes 63g of reloader 7 with the orange Harvester sabots and 325g SST which measure out to .504, the Mmp measured .502 and was too loose and would not fire. I shot five rounds with the reloader 7 and 2 out of the 5 had hang fires but still shot a great group. I have never had a hang fire before in this gun and I have shot it a lot. I'm not sure if it is because of the powder or the sabot which was tight enough to shoot a good group but not as tight as other load combinations I have shot in the past. Any suggestions would br appreciated.
You’re going to need to do some elimination of possible causes. First off could you be more specific about this statement, “sabot which was tight enough to shoot a good group but not as tight as other load combinations”. What other load combinations?
Is your breech plug clean or has not been cleaned for a while? Which primer are you using? Maybe a hotter primer may be needed for slower powder usage. Do you compress your powder load when seating bullet/sabot load?
I'm using winchester primers with all of my loads. The stated load of orange harvester and 325g SST loads tight enough that it ignited every time normally other than the two hang fires. I usually use MMP HPH 24's or the short MMP's with other loads and bullets and they are a little tighter down the bore than this load is what i meant to say.
The breech plug is a new arrowhead with the bushing and it is clean. And yes i do compress the load a little when loading.
I was thinking that maybe i should use another sabot to try and make the fit a little tighter and that might make the difference. I'm thinking the HPH 24 will be a little tighter fit although i haven't had a chance to mic them yet. I have not tried any of the other Harvester Sabots yet.
I just wasn't sure if the reloader 7 was temp sensitive or not or my issue was with the Sabots or Primers. I know that my gun likes a tighter fit.
Something is off if you are getting 502 from a MMP orange sabot. Ive shot a bunch of those with 458s and they have always been around .505-.506.
A Havrvester BLACK crushrib is normally the preferred sabot for 458s in the MLII. Those will be quite tight.
I thought the same thing. When i switched to the .458 bullets recently i bought both the MMP orange and Harvester orange sabots to try with the 300 grain .458 XTP's and .458 SST bullets. The only sabots i have ever used in the past have been MMP's. I put an XTP into the orange MMP and it went down with hardly any resistance and would not ignite. I tried the same MMP orange with the SST and same thing, loose fit and would not fire. I must have got a bad batch from them.
I will purchase some Harvester black crush rib sabots to try and see if they are tighter than the orange crush ribs. Thanks everyone for the replies so far.
Can change to a hotter primer. CCI209m or Federal 209A. Use the black crush rib sabot with .458 bullets and load a wool wad between the sabot and the powder. Any one or combination of these components should help with ignition Don't forget to drill out your breech plug to get excess carbon out of your flame channel.
I agree with the above posts that the black crush rib and would probably be a better choice of sabots for a 50 cal with .458s. While I have personally never felt the need for wads in my ML II with sabots, they are a quick and easy sanity check. I do use .060 veggie wads in my 45 cal sabotless .
"The government cannot give to anyone anything that it does not first take from someone else."
If the comment was simply "before you know it, you will have a 45 barrel and sabots will be a thing of the past." you wouldn't have heard a peep from me. But that first part of the comment is open to interpretation and I was looking for clarification. As so many feel the intent is good then I will bow out here.
My comments are the result of my addiction to SML's..... I also started with a Savage MLII and went through the learning curve of misfires, random fliers, etc. I now have four - 45's and a 40. For me, eliminating the weak link ( sabot ) was one of the best things I learned from this site. The knowledge I have learned from this group has been shared with many friends. Most of them now have a SML. No bad will intended.