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Post by elkman1310 on Mar 4, 2016 18:49:56 GMT -5
Very nice machine work. The debate on lugs or no lugs will always be a debate. I have 100% confidence in a properly fitted shoulder type plug with 9/19x18 threads approx. 1.300 in length that much metal contact is really strong. (I use a 5/16x3/64 cutter ) the .031 slot will cause you some problems if the plug and primer pocket are not correctly matched. I have used chucking reamers that range from .2395 to .240 and .2405. The .2405 still gives you a good seal and it lets the primer seat and extract a little easier.
The best way to setup your head space for your breech plug is by using a simple little head space plug. Just take a piece of .250 aluminum rod and turn it down to .235 and cut it to a AOL of .299 use this little plug as a head space for the primer. You head space the plug just like you were chambering a rifle. You want the bolt to just close on the little plug. ( Remember) to always take the firing pin out of the bolt so you can actually feel the face of the bolt nose make contact with the plug. When you do this right your primers will not stick. You also must check to see that the little plug sticks out about .080 to .090 that dimension will vary depending on who's plug your using.
If your bolt nose makes contact with the breech plug before it makes contact with the plug the primer pocket is cut to deep for your application. Since you our a skilled machinist take the time to make a short barrel stub and do a trial run on how your setup is really going to work. Once you start working on the barrel you don't won't any surprises I hope this info might help you and others.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2016 19:03:50 GMT -5
I can assure you .2405 would be an unacceptably tight fit.
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Post by elkman1310 on Mar 4, 2016 19:55:35 GMT -5
A CCI Mag 209 primer or a Federal 209A measures .239 to .241 in diameter they are not perfectly round. Ho do you think a .2405 diameter hole would be tight? Just what size do you use?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2016 20:03:09 GMT -5
A carbide chucking reamer, has to be carbide to cut the Luke plug. I was using a .241 for the entire depth of the pocket and topped with a .242 to a deepth of .130". Now I have slightly reduced my headspace and ream a .242 to the bottom on cf builds and .2425 on retention screw setups.
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Post by moto357 on Mar 4, 2016 20:21:53 GMT -5
I also use a carbide tipped reamer at .242 for Luke's plugs, snug but good fit for me.
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Post by elkman1310 on Mar 4, 2016 20:23:11 GMT -5
Well your wrong on that because I just worked on a Luke plug and it cuts pretty easy. Unless your head spacing the primer perfectly to the bottom of the breech plug a .2425 hole is simply to loose. A primer will almost drop into a .2425 hole. And from what I have seen and read Luke's are cut to deep and they are not a .242 size primer hole. I have had excellent results using a .2405 reamer and that gives a very nice snug fit on a cam screw action. If setup correctly you get zero blow bye. I have tested several different sizes and for me .2405 gives the most consistent results.
The other thing is I make my mine own breech plug and bolt nose assembly So my setup varies from the Hunter bolt nose setup. Bottom line if your setup works for you keep doing it. Same for me its working great. There is no one size fits all when it comes to building M/L'S The dimensions on the Remington M/L actions are all over the map. That's why guy's have trouble when they buy off the shelf parts and try to assemble them on their own.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2016 20:24:46 GMT -5
And I said daaave....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2016 20:34:25 GMT -5
The fact that you make each plug different is nothing short of disappointing. That's a terrible thing to do to customers, what do they do when they need another plug? Also hate to burst your egotistical bubble but you aren't headspacing any better than the prefits so why bother sending it to you? All you're doing is swueezing the side of the primer tight enough that it doesn't leak.
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Post by Dave W on Mar 4, 2016 20:47:31 GMT -5
My gun. Guy's gun You can see where the soot ends on the primers. If it was leaking past that point the primers would be dirty on the sides. With my calipers I get .242 ID on the plug. Whatever Cole is doing, it works! Kudos to the OP on some fine craftsmanship!
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Post by subcalshooter on Mar 4, 2016 21:09:14 GMT -5
Awesome tutorial on your project, it turned out very nice. IDK the first thing about machining, but I do know my fed primers come out of my 375 spotless, so I'd say the plug was machined as good as possible,as shown in daves pictures.
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Post by edge on Mar 5, 2016 11:57:20 GMT -5
PLAY NICE, Thanks edge.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2016 20:13:37 GMT -5
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Post by rambler on Mar 5, 2016 20:47:56 GMT -5
I was wondering when this would make it's appearance..... LOL
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Post by edge on Mar 5, 2016 21:19:56 GMT -5
"I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, punk?"
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Post by rambler on Mar 5, 2016 21:23:41 GMT -5
Definitely one of the greatest, if not the greatest, one liner's of all time!
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Post by edge on Mar 5, 2016 21:28:12 GMT -5
So do ya " gots to know!" ?
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Post by rambler on Mar 5, 2016 21:29:29 GMT -5
So do ya " gots to know!" ? Nope LOL
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Post by edge on Mar 5, 2016 21:31:59 GMT -5
Now back to your regularly scheduled program...
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Post by Earnhardt on Mar 5, 2016 22:07:56 GMT -5
And I disagree with both sides....
I don not set the head spacing so the primer nose is touching the breech plug. I don't use shims, and my plug was not machined back to be flush on purpose. Why?...
I test and interchange ASG breech plugs regularly with various sized bushing orifices.
One ASG plug has a .035", one has a .040", and I have others with sizes from 2 holes to .030". Trying to remove a tungsten bushing is nearly impossible to do without destroying or damaging it in some way. So I leave one ASG plug set up with a certain size bushing hole for testing with ignition, velocity, accuracy and blowback in relation to primer damage.
All my plugs seal on the side of the primers.
When we first started testing the plug I was told to slowly open the plug up...so I did. With great results...
The sides of my primers occaisionally have a little residue on them, but the ES's are tight and so are the groups. So I'm not concerned that they primers are not touching perfectly against the plug shelf. And secondly, I open up the PFC due to the heavy loads of powder I use, so there really isn't much there for the nose to seal on anyways.
My way is not better than your way...it just works for me.
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Post by spc136 on Mar 14, 2016 11:29:11 GMT -5
soooo whats the best plug for a Ml2 ? Im not trying to stir the pot ! Im just a newbe !
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Post by edge on Mar 14, 2016 11:53:31 GMT -5
soooo whats the best plug for a Ml2 ? Im not trying to stir the pot ! Im just a newbe ! IMO, if you have a Savage barrel then you want a Savage replacement available from various sources, Savage, Pete, I think PR Bullet, maybe Luke not sure. edge.
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Post by spc136 on Mar 14, 2016 12:45:45 GMT -5
ARROW HEAD plug any good ? looks like it has a shoulder to help gas pressure .
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Post by edge on Mar 14, 2016 13:02:59 GMT -5
ARROW HEAD plug any good ? looks like it has a shoulder to help gas pressure . Not unless you are getting a replacement barrel or re-machining the breech, they are NOT interchangeable. Luke MAY make a Savage replacement, I don't know for sure. edge.
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Post by spc136 on Mar 14, 2016 16:19:46 GMT -5
I was thinking of buying the Brux 45 barrel fitted for the arrow head plug . Whats the best replacement barrel for a ML2 ?
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Post by jims on Mar 14, 2016 20:14:25 GMT -5
"Best" is hard to define. The Brux is a quality barrel, PacNors do certainly well enough. For deer accuracy under 250 yards most of the replacement barrels are more than adequate but it would be nice to get one that uses either the new arrowhead plug if one did not want to go with the Savage breechplug design. If you get one already machined for either of those plugs you are ready to spin it on a Savage ML action. If you just buy a barrel blank there is considerable machining involved but you can get any barrel you like then. If I was getting a new replacement barrel I would seriously consider the arrowhead .45 barrels with the rear sealing plug from Luke. That is just me however and sodas come in different tastes and favors.
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