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Post by whyohe on Jan 20, 2009 18:05:46 GMT -5
how many states left that have a flintlock ONLY season. PA still has a late season flint lock only season . it seems to be getting harder to get a flintlock and parts for them as the years go on.
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Post by topusmc on Feb 23, 2009 8:19:57 GMT -5
Whyohe
If you check out BUY AND SELL, click on, 4 sale. most All the parts that are mentioned are for traditional guns. I can send you a pic via e-m, but I don't know how to post pics on this site. Its a good buy and you may be able to use some.
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 30, 2009 2:35:00 GMT -5
Here in Virginia we're trying to get a "Late Primitive Season" . Ours hopefully will be for "sidelocks" only (IE Percussion or Flintlock) also no scopes or sabots ! The Virginia Division of Game and Inland Fisheries has neither said ney or yeah so far . So we shall see ! I belong to an organization here in VA and here's our website ; www.vmlra.orgThere are some links to places you may be able to find flintlock parts ! |
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Mar 30, 2009 17:34:34 GMT -5
I have a question?
Why do some folks want a "specific weapon only" season? It's just a question. IMO, it just gets more complicated and restrictive. Most states offer an Archery, Regular gun and ML season. Things are already fairly diversified. I see pros and cons each way.
To take ML season and break it down to Smokeless...Inline BP....or Sidelock gets awfully complicated and almost self fullfilling for those in favor. It would be like having a "recurve only" archery season where compounds stay at home.
Do we need spear seasons...or deadfall seasons? I am not poking fun here just trying to understand the logic. If a guy wants to kill a deer with a flintlock, load up your flintlock and go hunting. If the guy on the neighboring property is using his Knight Disc, he won't be infringing on you. If you score with the weapon of your choice isn't it sweeter knowing you did so....no matter what the other guy is using?
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 30, 2009 20:36:07 GMT -5
I have a question? Why do some folks want a "specific weapon only" season? It's just a question. IMO, it just gets more complicated and restrictive. Most states offer an Archery, Regular gun and ML season. Things are already fairly diversified. I see pros and cons each way. To take ML season and break it down to Smokeless...Inline BP....or Sidelock gets awfully complicated and almost self fullfilling for those in favor. It would be like having a "recurve only" archery season where compounds stay at home. Do we need spear seasons...or deadfall seasons? I am not poking fun here just trying to understand the logic. If a guy wants to kill a deer with a flintlock, load up your flintlock and go hunting. If the guy on the neighboring property is using his Knight Disc, he won't be infringing on you. If you score with the weapon of your choice isn't it sweeter knowing you did so....no matter what the other guy is using? Well lets see ! Usually when people ask me "why" I answer with "why not" . To me those two questions are pretty much 50/50 ! Personally I hunt with the entire spectrum of things from archery to speed demon bolt actions and all in between ! And as to the possibility of hunting with a flintlock during the regular ML season you are totally correct ! My state has a proposed season in january after our general firearms season closes . We have asked for the remaining week days and saturdays of that month . The reasoning behind this is that the Game Commision says the deer population east of the Blue Ridge mountains is getting abit out of control and it adds more time for the harvesting of excess aniamls . It also gives those who prefer to handicap themselves an open oppurtunity to hunt when others won't be hindering them in any way . In my own situation this is unimportant as I hunt on my own property and one or two other places that are private . Now in all actuality I doubt if the take in the last 3 weeks of january will be 2% of the total deer take for the year . But on the other hand if it affords someone more oppurtunities who are you or I to deny this to anyone . I suppose my final comment to your question on this issue would be if a person doesn't care to participate in any NEW season that may be upcoming there is nothing forcing them to do so . And I can understand someone getting upset if the Game Commission tried to take say a week of the regular ML season away just for the Primitive ML's and I personally agree with them getting upset about that . But as long as it's added in a way to not take anything from any other faction , there should be no "why" question ! |
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Mar 31, 2009 3:33:13 GMT -5
I do not dispute anything you say...this is all opinions here.  On a side note: It is funny though how Conservation Depts run things. If the deer are getting a little "out of control" as you say, it would seem prudent to unleash everyone, along with more proficient weapons, and get that number up a little more then the 2% you estimated. As far as giving people who PREFER to handicap themselves without the "hinderance" of others? If people prefer to handicap themselves...GO FOR IT. NO one is HINDERING anyone else. Is the goal of this extra month a conservationist goal of a healthier herd? Or is it a way for a self imposed handicapped group to deny all the other groups attempts to help with herd control? When someone answers a "why?" question with a "why not?" it is usually a way to dodge an answer. Some "why" questions need a constructive answer. When the game commission asks your group "why do you want this season restricted to Flintlocks?...we need a honest attempt at herd reduction." Are you going to just simply say "Why not?" When they ask "why do you want to rule out everyone but yourselves?" Will you answer "Why not?" You are entitled to your opinions, hopes and wishes....especially here. You can consider this a debate if you want but I am only explaining the other side of this coin. If NYS did this....and I had to buy and set-up a gun to participate...I'd be a little upset. I love to hunt and I would definately contribute to the goal of herd reduction. If folks want to "handicap" themselves...they can. Just don't hinder the other guy in the process. |
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Post by whyohe on Mar 31, 2009 6:58:20 GMT -5
wilms, i think here in PA its more of a tradition. the "primative " season has been here for as long as i can remember. it is a season that some here have enjoyed and prefer to keep it the way it is. now PA 5 years ago implimented the early season in-line ML season, in oct, to get more into hunting and to help with doe population,cause it is doe only season. also in primative season since you do need to get close there is no florescent orange required bit with the more powerful inlines orange is required. so i wonder if safety is a side issue? these are just my opinions.
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 31, 2009 8:47:47 GMT -5
When someone answers a "why?" question with a "why not?" it is usually a way to dodge an answer. Some "why" questions need a constructive answer. When the game commission asks your group "why do you want this season restricted to Flintlocks?...we need a honest attempt at herd reduction." Are you going to just simply say "Why not?" If NYS did this....and I had to buy and set-up a gun to participate...I'd be a little upset. I think my "why not" answer comes back to my thoughts that if you don't care or wish to participate please DON'T as no one is forcing you , while on the other hand if you don't care to participate don't try and restrict me because you don't want to ! As to be restricted to JUST flintlocks as you mention , thats not what we petitioned the state for . We asked for "sidelock" meaning flint or percussion . Also the time we asked for in addition to all the other seasons we have in Virginia is additional and steps on no others factions toes . Based on the way you come across I don't think you are aware of the seasons in Virginia ! We start the first saturday in october with bow season which runs until the ML starts on the first saturday of november . ML runs until the third saturday of november when the gun season starts and runs until the first saturday in january . During this time we have a state big game tag thats good for three slicks and three more either bucks or slicks . On top of that we can purchase unlimited bonus tags for slicks . Our daily bag limit is two per day , and we have doe days now from the start to finish ! So if nothing else adding one to three weeks in january after all the other seasons are over would just be a slight oppurtunity to add some to the total state take and also give me a couple more weeks to wind down ! As it is now I normally hunt the last 3 weeks of january in Maryland since they have archery season until 1/31 each year . But if Virginia see's fit to add a primitive ML season then I'll stay home and hunt here ! |
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 31, 2009 8:55:30 GMT -5
also in primative season since you do need to get close there is no florescent orange required bit with the more powerful inlines orange is required. so i wonder if safety is a side issue? these are just my opinions. A large number of the fellows at the yearly meeting of the "Virginia Muzzle Loading Rifle Association" voiced that as a reason for a seperate season . For me personally it's more time to be in the woods ! I normally take 10-20 deer each year with 90% being donated to our local food kitchen , so anything I would possibly take in a proposed primitive season would follow suit ! When we had the meeting and the actual proposition was drafted for the Game COmmission it amazed me how many folks we had in Virginia that seem to want to go out as a person would have back about 1780 ! Now personally I like "Contemporary Flintlock Longrifles" but I think I'll stop just shy of dressing the part ! When it comes to clothing when I hunt I kinda like Thinsulate and Gore Tex ;D |
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Post by wilmsmeyer on Mar 31, 2009 16:34:59 GMT -5
I still stand by the points I made...even though you fellows are probably very "hunted out"....2 a day...whew. Everyone surely must get lots of opportunities.
I surely wasn't trying to pee on your sandwich...just trying to get by the "hindering" part.
If deer herds need balance, hunting is the best way. Including all implements and troops. Hope it works out.
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Post by whyohe on Mar 31, 2009 16:45:56 GMT -5
i like it cause it is a quiet season with low pressure. i like it when it doesnt sound like a war zone while hunting. i think it give thoes with a nitch to even more enjoy their sport. you can use your ML stamp for early season and late season but rules are different.
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 31, 2009 19:19:28 GMT -5
...even though you fellows are probably very "hunted out"....2 a day...whew. Everyone surely must get lots of opportunities. Over the course of a season I'll start in Maryland of september 15th and hunt pretty constant until january 31st when the archery season goes out in Maryland ! The Virginia limit now is two per day all season long in my county as I said earlier ! But the Maryland bag limit can be as much as 14 per day ! In Maryland it's perfectly leagl to kill 10 slicks , two bucks and a pair of Sika deer in EACH of the 3 seasons with no daily bag limit other then the season limit ! so in Maryland the hunter may legally harvest 42 deer on his big game tag ! As I also said earlier most years between the two states I kill 10-20 deer . And I normally process all of them myself . Needless to say the years I get close to the 20 mark I am pretty tired of messing with them by the end of the year . |
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Post by 6ptsika on Mar 31, 2009 19:28:39 GMT -5
i like it when it doesnt sound like a war zone while hunting. In Virginia on the first morning of the rifle season you might hear 9 shots from sunrise until 9AM . The FIRST year I hunted the rifle opener in PA I heard 94 shots by 9AM . An my friends up there told me 94 shots was nothing for opening morning compared to years past  |
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Post by screwbolts on Apr 12, 2009 14:45:40 GMT -5
wilms, i think here in PA its more of a tradition. the "primative " season has been here for as long as i can remember. it is a season that some here have enjoyed and prefer to keep it the way it is. now PA 5 years ago implimented the early season in-line ML season, in oct, to get more into hunting and to help with doe population,cause it is doe only season. also in primative season since you do need to get close there is no florescent orange required bit with the more powerful inlines orange is required. so i wonder if safety is a side issue? these are just my opinions. Why do you say a inline is more powerfull? What is your standard of power that makes it more Powerful? Some of the most "powerful" hunting guns of the past were flintlocks. I have friends in PA that tell me the early season is a Muzzleloader season and not a specific "inline" season, isn't it legal to use any muzzleloading rifle during your early season? Ken |
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Post by 6ptsika on Apr 12, 2009 16:51:58 GMT -5
wilms, i think here in PA its more of a tradition. the "primative " season has been here for as long as i can remember. it is a season that some here have enjoyed and prefer to keep it the way it is. now PA 5 years ago implimented the early season in-line ML season, in oct, to get more into hunting and to help with doe population,cause it is doe only season. also in primative season since you do need to get close there is no florescent orange required bit with the more powerful inlines orange is required. so i wonder if safety is a side issue? these are just my opinions. Why do you say a inline is more powerfull? What is your standard of power that makes it more Powerful? Some of the most "powerful" hunting guns of the past were flintlocks. I have friends in PA that tell me the early season is a Muzzleloader season and not a specific "inline" season, isn't it legal to use any muzzleloading rifle during your early season? Ken During the early ML season in PA anything goes , but in what is thought of as the regular ML season it is Flintlock only with all lead projectiles and no sabots . Used to be patched roundball's only but I think you can now shoot lead conical bullets as well . |
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Post by whyohe on Apr 13, 2009 18:01:28 GMT -5
screwbolts, you are right, it is not in-line specific but alot of people refer it to that because you are allowed to use them.
IMO they are more"powerful" cause you can use more powder in them than most flintlocks, and that the projectiles that are allowed IMO have better hitting power. the primative season use to be patch and round ball only for the projectile but now you are able to use a maxi-ball /conical. ill have to look but i dont think bullet/ plastic sabot are permitted in primative season either.
also both projectiles musr be 44 cal or larger not including sabot.
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Post by basspastor on Nov 5, 2009 15:30:39 GMT -5
In Texas you can use a Muzzle Loader anytime except Bow season and they do have a late Muzzleloader season (not just Flintlock) I guess to them a Muzzleloader is a Muzzleloader.
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Post by mountainam on Nov 6, 2009 0:29:59 GMT -5
I have a lot of friends in PA that would like to get involved with muzzleloaders,but most will not because of the flintlock only season. Our sport needs participants.When you exclude participants the sport of hunting suffers as a whole.The flintlock only season is a few weeks after the deer are shot at and chased in regular gun season. Then you're allowed to go and use your flintlock in the most humid and damp conditions. It's almost like the Game Commission doesn't want you to get anything. If flintlock is your thing have at it. Don't exclude others.It's the same as other States excluding the crossbow from bow season. When you check with the Game Commission they will tell you the biggest hurdle is the fellow Bowhunters. I'm glade here in Ohio we got past all that. Sure, it gives you something to argue about at camp but nobody is excluded.Yeah, I suppose it's great to have the whole woods to yourself,but it doesn't promote the sport of hunting much.
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Post by mike3132 on Nov 6, 2009 15:14:07 GMT -5
I like to see one here in Indiana. A 5 day season around the second week of October for side hammer guns only using open sights, black powder only (no BP subs), patch & round ball or maxi-ball, flints, # 11 or musket caps. No inlines or scopes allowed. Mike
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Post by whyohe on Nov 6, 2009 15:51:48 GMT -5
if they want, they can use a ML during rifle season. no rules aginst that and they have had early season in line -doe only for 5-6 years now. if that is the way the feel then we should just have a rifle season and you can use any thing you want from Oct to mid jan. if people REALLY want to get into some thing they will. i have 3 MLrs and shoot them year round. i have shot does and a buck with my inline during rifle season so why not them.
i like it cause it is a challenge that time of year. yes we have wet snow and it is cold but that is the fun of it to me. by that time of year how many more deer do we need to harvest?
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Post by ripshod on Nov 11, 2009 6:50:25 GMT -5
I have hunted in the Pa Flintlock season since 1978.When it first came into existence you could only hunt on state game lands.I can honestly say that last season I hunted all but 2 days and I did not see one hunter.I hunt mostly on National Forest property.I must say that I enjoy being the only hunter in the woods.I am pretty sure that sabots are legal as I have harvested my last 3 deer with saboted bullets.The main reason that there is no hunting pressure is that the deer herd has been reduced and public land has seen the largest reductions.
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Post by whyohe on Nov 12, 2009 12:53:16 GMT -5
ripshod, becareful. it use to be that bullet/sabot was not legal only patch and round ball OR maxi ball. but i see it reads SINGLE projectile. if the warden views a saboted bullet as 2 pieces you might be in trouble.
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Post by petev on Nov 14, 2009 10:10:36 GMT -5
[quote author=6ptsika board=traditional thread=165 post=11869
My state has a proposed season in january after our general firearms season closes . We have asked for the remaining week days and saturdays of that month . The reasoning behind this is that the Game Commision says the deer population east of the Blue Ridge mountains is getting abit out of control and it adds more time for the harvesting of excess aniamls .
Now in all actuality I doubt if the take in the last 3 weeks of january will be 2% of the total deer take for the year . But on the other hand if it affords someone more oppurtunities who are you or I to deny this to anyone .
ld be no "why" question ![/quote]
I have a question about January hunting. Is hunting in the dead of winter a good idea, regardless of the type of weapon used? The deer are starting to enter a near starvation mode of existence, and are feeding very little (at least in the north). Their strategy seems to be to expend less energy. Is it a good idea to bother them under those circumstances, or is it time to give them a rest?
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Post by whyohe on Nov 14, 2009 15:58:39 GMT -5
petev,IMO if the deer are near starvation then no better time to take them and leave more foliage and what ever is left to eat for another deer. in my experience there is less pressure and they are not moving as much and you really have to think and know how the deer in your area move. it is a challenge and a joy to me to hunt in Jan.
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Post by 6ptsika on Nov 28, 2009 22:39:31 GMT -5
[quote author=6ptsika board=traditional thread=165 post=11869 My state has a proposed season in january after our general firearms season closes . We have asked for the remaining week days and saturdays of that month . The reasoning behind this is that the Game Commision says the deer population east of the Blue Ridge mountains is getting abit out of control and it adds more time for the harvesting of excess aniamls . Now in all actuality I doubt if the take in the last 3 weeks of january will be 2% of the total deer take for the year . But on the other hand if it affords someone more oppurtunities who are you or I to deny this to anyone . ld be no "why" question ! I have a question about January hunting. Is hunting in the dead of winter a good idea, regardless of the type of weapon used? The deer are starting to enter a near starvation mode of existence, and are feeding very little (at least in the north). Their strategy seems to be to expend less energy. Is it a good idea to bother them under those circumstances, or is it time to give them a rest? [/quote] Unless there is a drastic change in the overall weather in Virginia a late "Primitive" season is no worse on the deer in our area then any other time ! We don't get the cold cold winters anylonger that we did when I was a kis in the 60's . I also bow hunt Maryland in january and they've been doing that far longer then I've been hunting the eastern shore of Maryland . I also hunt the Chincoteague NWR in Virginia during January when I get drawn ! Heck I'm gonna be in Arkansas in late late january and early february this coming year to pig hunt/cull hunt whitetails on a friend of a friends 90,000 acres ! |
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