|
|
Post by rangeball on Apr 22, 2009 16:05:23 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by Harley on Apr 22, 2009 16:34:06 GMT -5
I've never used a boresighter, Rangeball, but always thought it might be an iffy thing to line up with the bore. This one looks pretty much idiot proof as long as your muzzle-end is square.
Harley
|
|
|
|
Post by wilmsmeyer on Apr 22, 2009 16:37:16 GMT -5
I do not want to poo-hoo these gadgets as they can be useful I guess.
It is very easy to get on paper at 100 yds with just 1-2 shots just by shooting 1 shot at 25 yds very carefully and exptrapolating the math at 100 yds and making the adjustment.
Guys I've seen using bore sighters never get by without some adjusting unless they get lucky.
A scope with reliable adjustments are needed to do it my way...
Ex: your shot at 25 yds is 3 inches left and 1 inch low at 25 yds. Roughly, this would translate to 12 inches left and 4 inches low at 100 yds. Notice that I said roughly....the bore-to-line-of-sight relationship will skew this a little but not too much to make you miss a 1 foot square at 100 yds.
Make the adjustment. If 1/4 minute clicks....48 right and 16 up. Take one careful shot at 100 yds. If it is within 3 inches of intented POI shoot a group. If more, make a slight adjustment and shoot a group.
Even with the best boresighter, you'll be playing this game a little. 1 or 2 shots after boresighting will not give you the confidence that a few groups and minor adjustments followed by a few more groups will. IMO IMO
There are other ways as well...like looking down the barrel and adjusting the crosshairs to where the barrel seems to be pointed. Some do this with success. Never did it.
No matter the method used, mounting the scope properly is paramount. Once it's mounted, your gun will shoot where it will shoot and your scope will have a finite amount of adjustment to correct for where it is hitting.
|
|
|
|
Post by bigmoose on Apr 22, 2009 17:26:51 GMT -5
Remove the BP, sight the rifle in a firm hold, like a lead sled, and have a friend dial the changes,
I do it myself, but some folks like the two man system. no need for the bore sighter.
That said I have a Leupold bore sighter that I use to check zero after long plane trips, great tool
PS, I have never had a zero change do to travel,
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave W on Apr 22, 2009 17:34:41 GMT -5
Like the others I never saw the real need for one. Powder or gadget hmmm?  Powder always wins. ;D |
|
|
|
Post by 12ptdroptine on Apr 22, 2009 17:42:39 GMT -5
My right eye down the bore work's for me. After I tried this the first time I never had another boresighted at the shop. Drop
|
|
|
|
Post by ET on Apr 22, 2009 19:51:50 GMT -5
Rangeball
One other use I plan for my laser bore sighter is quickly ligning up my Chrony at the range.
Line up on target, turn on bore sighter and shift chrony that has a sheet attached to it to quickly align height and position. Of course this will be done with an unloaded ML so laser has to be removed before shooting. ;D
Ed
|
|
|
|
Post by jims on Apr 22, 2009 20:28:21 GMT -5
All the above methods work and I have used the same but I do have a laser boresighter. I can use it at home to get close then it is easy at the range. But then I like gadgets.
|
|
|
|
Post by mshm99 on Apr 22, 2009 21:00:04 GMT -5
I like them. You can diagnose a scope or mount problem easily.
mshm
|
|
|
|
Post by Harley on Apr 22, 2009 21:39:39 GMT -5
Like I said, I've never used one. My method has always been to remove the bolt, firmly bed the rifle on the rest and look through the bore at the 100 yard target, then align the scope. I can't remember a time that has not worked for me.
However, I find it a royal pain to align my persnickety chrony, necessitating a dozen adjustments to the tripod. Ed's use of the laser boresighter is simply elegant. Now I've created an instant NEED!
Harley
|
|
|
|
Post by raf on Apr 22, 2009 21:46:04 GMT -5
ET. That's a good idea. Never thought of it. Would save a lot of time at the range.
I have a laser bore sighter. It replaces taking out the bolt or BP and sighting down the bore. You can use it indoors or where ever. Mine came with a target of sorts. You can use it a close range and it compensates for the height of the scope above the bore. Since I got mine it puts me on paper. I don't bother to shoot at 25 yds. I go straight to 100 yds. I do use a large piece of poster paper under my usual target just in case but haven't needed it. I couldn't use it last week with a 17 HMR 'cause mine is only good for 20 - 50 cal. I did it the old fashioned way by sighting down the bore at a spot about 75 yds away. Anyway I like it. I got mine from Cabelas. IMO they're all the same.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2009 21:48:55 GMT -5
rangeball
I bought one of those $40 boresighters from Cabelas and it proved to be useless. I only use it now to line up my Chronograph. A couple shots at 25yds will get you on at 100.
Zen
|
|
|
|
Post by ET on Apr 22, 2009 22:27:29 GMT -5
ET. That's a good idea. Never thought of it. Would save a lot of time at the range. Don't know how many times I have fooled around at the range setting up my chrony to get the best readings. It was almost a chore at times to get it right. Now I have a way to quickly do this and make sure I don't line up my chrony instead of my target. ;D Ed |
|
|
|
Post by raf on Apr 23, 2009 9:43:41 GMT -5
rangeball I bought one of those $40 boresighters from Cabelas and it proved to be useless. I only use it now to line up my Chronograph. A couple shots at 25yds will get you on at 100. Zen I find it odd you can't make it work. Are you using the target thing that came with it for close range setting? Mine worked right out of the box. I use it at about 30 feet and have always been on paper at 100 yds. Once you've put it in the bore, are you tightening it so it aligns with the bore? Just some thoughts. |
|
|
|
Post by raf on Apr 23, 2009 9:45:21 GMT -5
ET. That's a good idea. Never thought of it. Would save a lot of time at the range. Don't know how many times I have fooled around at the range setting up my chrony to get the best readings. It was almost a chore at times to get it right. Now I have a way to quickly do this and make sure I don't line up my chrony instead of my target. ;D Ed Am I right when I would line up the target first and with the rifle resting on the rest then line up the bore sighter with the chrony? |
|
|
|
Post by dougedwards on Apr 23, 2009 12:20:57 GMT -5
Like I said, I've never used one. My method has always been to remove the bolt, firmly bed the rifle on the rest and look through the bore at the 100 yard target, then align the scope. I can't remember a time that has not worked for me. However, I find it a royal pain to align my persnickety chrony, necessitating a dozen adjustments to the tripod. Ed's use of the laser boresighter is simply elegant. Now I've created an instant NEED! Harley I don't pull the bolt or do anything beside stick this little magnetic gadget on the end of the barrel and set the reticle to the image produced by the bore sighter. It works with the visual imaging of the scope. After that I go directly to 100 yard range and make adjustments from there. Usually it will be several inches off but easily adjusted from there. www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/leupold-zero-point-boresighter.aspx?a=471677 Doug |
|
|
|
Post by ET on Apr 23, 2009 18:43:33 GMT -5
Don't know how many times I have fooled around at the range setting up my chrony to get the best readings. It was almost a chore at times to get it right. Now I have a way to quickly do this and make sure I don't line up my chrony instead of my target. ;D Ed Am I right when I would line up the target first and with the rifle resting on the rest then line up the bore sighter with the chrony? RAF I would first basically setup rifle to zero on target. Align chrono position by eye, set alignment sheet in chrony and turn on laser bore sighter. Then adjust chrony for laser to hit cross hair on alignment sheet.  The alignment sheet basically outlines the window as the rods would and lets me know where the bullet should cross the chrony once laser is set on cross hairs. Ed |
|
|
|
Post by Harley on Apr 24, 2009 8:46:18 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Apr 24, 2009 9:02:22 GMT -5
Thanks fellas. Lot's of good responses here  Up to this point, I've always gone with the powder, shooting at my close zero range (determined by trajectory program) then moving to 100 and fine tuning. What I was thinking this thing would do would be to make it easy for me to tell if I need to use the +/- inserts with my signature rings, when mounting a scope, before going to the range, firing and ending up having to take the scope off to swap inserts and start over. Does anyone have this exact laser I linked? On question I have about it, when you watch the video at the link, it looks like there is nothing to make sure you have it centered on your bore, just held magnetically wherever you put it. But when I looked at the manufacturers website, it shows an angled piece off the back that appears to fit into your bore, slid in until it hits the bore, to center it. I think it said new for '09, so if I end up getting one, I'd want to make sure I got a new one and not old stock, if they are in fact different. Thanks again |
|
|
|
Post by Harley on Apr 24, 2009 10:15:28 GMT -5
Rangeball, I looked at the video, also, and had the same question you did: if the magnetic part is not centered on the bore, nothing good will happen. I don't know anything about "new for 2009", but the one I did order looks good.
Harley
|
|
|
|
Post by mshm99 on Apr 24, 2009 11:06:08 GMT -5
Harley, I got the Bushnell on clearance last year for $22.00. Same unit. Plenty good enoughfor me. You'll like it.
mshm
|
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Apr 24, 2009 12:42:07 GMT -5
Harley, I looked at the one you bought. One question I would have related to my gun is I have a QLA. No idea if that will affect how tight the .50 arbor fits or not, so the laser stays concentric. Harley, here's the link to the new one they make- sightmark.com/catalog/product/45Available with a red or green laser. Since this kind of goes hand in hand, are you guys that are using boresighters using it to make sure your scope/reticle is mounted level? If not, and for the rest of you, how are you addressing this? |
|
|
|
Post by Harley on Apr 24, 2009 15:03:35 GMT -5
Thanks, mshm; looking forward to it. I'm only planning to use it with orienting my chrony, so am hopeful it's adequate.
Rangeball, here's the way I assure a level crosshair:
1.You will need a level; be certain it's correctly oriented; i.e., some of the bubbles, when centered, do not actually correspond with a true level condition. The way I checked mine was to set it in a framing square; then lined up the vertical arm of the framing square with a weighted plumb line. I found that my level's bubble indicated it was not level, when in fact it was. There are ways to correct this, but you can just mark a corrected spot on the bubble glass with a felt pen.
2. Lay this now accurate level across the flats of the rifle action. (Note that some actions may be below the wood stock. In that case you must remove the action from the stock.)
3. With the bubble centered on the action, line up your loosely mounted scope with a weighted plumb line, turn the scope to parallel that line, then tighten. (Don't forget to orient your scope for correct eye relief.)
It's a little bit of work that will pay off on long shots.
Harley
|
|
|
|
Post by rangeball on Apr 24, 2009 15:59:12 GMT -5
Thanks Harley. I've always done it by eyesite and a plumb door, but most of my stuff is short range weapons so it's worked fine.
|
|
|
|
Post by mshm99 on Apr 24, 2009 18:38:29 GMT -5
rangeball: I have the QLA also.No problem!
I'm more concerned with orienting my cross hairs by shouldering the weapon and using plumb lines to adjust the vertical line. Not everbody anchors the weapon to the shoulder plumb. It's harder for me to get this right ,but I think it's worth the trouble.
Just my opinion.
mshm
|
|
|
|
Post by raf on Apr 24, 2009 21:39:41 GMT -5
Maybe I'm wrong but what I do when I mount a new scope on the rifle is look at the vertical cross hair. If it lined up with the center of the top of the bolt it's right. Doesn't matter if you cant the rifle it's square to the rifle.
|
|
|
|
Post by mshm99 on Apr 25, 2009 11:31:11 GMT -5
If your vertical cross hair is plumb and square to the bore center line,and you cant the weapon when you anchor at your cheek weld,any adjustments you make will have to be both windage and elevation because you will always deviate from the vertical center line with any elevation adjustment.
By closing your eyes and shouldering the weapon,then opening your eyes, you will find your natural anchor point ,cant or not. Adjust your vertical line accordingly as well as eye relief.
I regard this as making the weapon conform to you rather than the opposite. Some other things I look at ,length of pull and the drop at the comb. I believe it makes for getting on target quicker.
Just my opinion
mshm
|
|
