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Post by littlejoe on Dec 18, 2009 19:44:23 GMT -5
I posted this pic on another thread and it has generated some interest.I am going to make some more if anyone wants one.
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Post by Jon on Dec 18, 2009 20:13:35 GMT -5
I would be interested as long as the bullet is in the barrel far enough to have the whole spinjag in when I shift to the ramrod. Let me know the price. Jon
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 18, 2009 20:35:13 GMT -5
It sends the bullet down the same distance as with the stock black sleeve.I Just need to know if you have retained your front sight or removed it.I haven't come up with a price yet.When I get a batch from the machine shop I will post a price.I plan on taking one to Gunn innovations to see if they like it and they can sell them.
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Post by onecardchuck on Dec 18, 2009 21:15:39 GMT -5
I would be interested in one and I did not retain my front sight.
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 18, 2009 21:26:29 GMT -5
I wonder if any of yall have any idea of a reasonable price?I am not a business man.So far all of them are hand made on a manual lathe,front sight channel requires another machining process on the milling machine.A CNC machine could crank 'em out fast.So far the only one that exists is the one in the pic.
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Post by Jon on Dec 18, 2009 22:49:35 GMT -5
Littlejoe, Just to let you know I don't have any sights on of my savages except one that I plan to rebarrel if it needs milling I can take care of that. What material are you using? Jon
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 18, 2009 23:39:28 GMT -5
It is some sort of plastic used to make bushings.Looks like neoprene,might be Thordon.
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Post by songdog on Dec 19, 2009 9:46:28 GMT -5
Littlejoe, I would be interested in one too! I left the front sight on my rifle as well. PM me if you decide to make a run of these. As to pricing you would want the keep it low enough that folks are not "scared" off and think of it as just another gimmick, yet you want to make a profit as well. Better to sell a BUNCH at a LOWER price than just a FEW at a HIGHER price! The material cost is not the factor in pricing. It will be the advertising, packaging and shipping. Once set up for the CNC then the labor factor becomes nil as well. Looks like a neat product though. I admit, I get tired of my Spinjag loader slipping off of my muzzle when shoving those TIGHT saboted bulledts down my barrel!!! Merry Christmas to all!
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Post by Jon on Dec 19, 2009 18:38:43 GMT -5
Littlejoe I used to use a lot of uhmw for bushings rollers etc. as long as it is not a high load area it is a great bushing materal I found it to be better than alumnium bronze in some applications. Unless you have cnc machines at your disposal I don't think there would be enough demand to pay programing set up etc. But getting a good progression going it is suprising how much you can put out on manual machines there was a time when that was the way everything was done. Jon
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Post by rexxer on Dec 19, 2009 19:13:59 GMT -5
Hey little Joe
Are the sleeves you are planning to make tapered to match the Savage barrel taper? The problem lies with people having different barrels lengths also have different diameters. I built a few last year that had the taper matched to my barrel. They worked extremely well,find one design to fit all was the problem. Good luck with your project and I hope it works out!
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Post by Jon on Dec 19, 2009 19:33:18 GMT -5
Rexxer A very good question I have 2 50's and 2 45's there is only at most .030 differance between them is that enough to be a problem?Jon
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Post by rexxer on Dec 19, 2009 20:07:34 GMT -5
little joe Here's a picture of a few I built last year. They do work extremely well.I built mine out of Delrin,extremely tough! Picture shown without pusher rod.
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Post by rexxer on Dec 19, 2009 20:30:51 GMT -5
Rexxer A very good question I have 2 50's and 2 45's there is only at most .030 differance between them is that enough to be a problem?Jon Jon-Don't quote me but I believe the taper on the Savage is in the .010 per inch ball park. This is were the problems lie,in your case one barrel would fit approx three inches father in the taper than the other. The sleeve tapers matches the outside barrel .The barrel then almost bottoms out on the .452 bore. If it bottoms before the taper gets tight it will rock back and forth. If tapers lock too early there is too much distance between the barrel and the .452 bore. Its kinda hard to explain but timing is very critical. These dimensions were for my .45 Pacnor. They do work awesome when the timing is right. littlejoe -might not be using the tapers to lock sleeve to barrel so this might not even concern him. I'm just giving a heads up on the concerns I had. Thanks Rexxer
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Post by Jon on Dec 19, 2009 21:31:02 GMT -5
Rexxer, I followed your improvement before there lies my question I know being exact is great but compaired to holding it by hand wouldn't having a .020 fudge factor be an improvement? Jon
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Post by rexxer on Dec 19, 2009 22:01:27 GMT -5
Jon- I would guess yes but then it might not be no better than the spin jag sleeve. I believe they use the flat bottom to keep the sleeve parallel to the bore. If the sleeve was just counter bored instead of taper might work just fine. It would allow a much larger tolerence.
Hillbill and I talked about making one that held the sabot and bullet in the ready mode in case a quick follow up shot was needed.
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 19, 2009 23:42:37 GMT -5
Yeah guys,I am using the taper of a stock length barrel. Custom barrel lengths would require a larger bore.Keep in mind the taper of the barrel does not have a continuous rate, or else the breech end would be huge.You would have to mic your barrel to be precise.
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Post by Jon on Dec 20, 2009 4:41:25 GMT -5
guys just a thought make a sleeve for each barrel that also fits the spinjag loader? My loader is 45 but I've used it to load 50 also? Jon
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Post by rexxer on Dec 20, 2009 10:30:13 GMT -5
Jon-I think littlejoe could probably sell just the sleeve with a generic short starter as the pusher. littlejoe- Looks like you understand about the taper. It would be great if you could put these starters in some of the members hands.I'm not sure what kind of price you will come up with but if it involves cnc work it is not cheap. I hope members understand that these sleeves are not mass produced by injection molding. These will have to made one at a time and will have a certain amount of labor. I feel like I should bow out of this thread as it seems like I might be stepping on littlejoe's toes. I was just trying to let him know some of the problems I came up with. I have no intentions of making anymore! Good luck littlejoe,Like I said before,they work great!!!
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Post by unloaded on Dec 20, 2009 17:59:25 GMT -5
If you bored or drilled out most of the center material for "blanks" you could have some tapered reamers to finish them off with the correct angle. The tools might cost a bit but once you had them the parts could be quickly/easily made on much simpler machinery. It would be cheaper than programming and runtime on CNC machines. I do like the idea. I've got a Super Rat jag and I'm going to monkey around with this idea when I go back to work after the holidays.
peace. unloaded
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 21, 2009 11:30:37 GMT -5
Alright guys, is $20 too much? I can get them in a week or two.Ship out from the local UPS store in Va.Same price with or without sight channel,be sure to specify which.send PM. Also this is only for Savage MLII with factory barrel and works with the Spinjag loader(not included).
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 21, 2009 19:05:13 GMT -5
Well guys, I had about a forty minute conversation with the man that owns Gunn Innovations (maker of the Spinjag)today.He said that his CNC machine is not big enough to make these sleeves.He also said that although these things work well(and he has seen similar sleeves at muzzleloader shoots) the problem is there are too many different barrel contours to make them cost effective to produce.He also gave me his blessing and wished me good luck.
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Post by unloaded on Dec 21, 2009 19:08:49 GMT -5
For $20 I'll take one. Do you use Paypal? I'll shoot you a PM so I'm on the list.
peace. unloaded
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Post by Jon on Dec 21, 2009 21:35:16 GMT -5
Littlejoe, I appreciate your efforts I only have one oem barrel that is on a ml1 My other 3 are everything from a bull barrel to a 25in. I'm not sure what barrel will be on the one I'm working on now. Wish you luck I think it is a great idea. Jon
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 22, 2009 21:19:41 GMT -5
Sleeves will be ready to ship late next week.$20 each + $5 shipping and handling.You can use Paypal , click"send money"Tab and enter my email littlecrew5@netzero.com.After sending payment, please send me an email confirming your name,quantity,W or W/O sight channel,and your shipping address.Remember "ONLY FOR SAVAGE MLII WITH FACTORY BARREL"Merry Christmas,Joe Little
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Post by dpoor65 on Dec 23, 2009 9:10:57 GMT -5
I would give it a try for a fair price....
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Post by littlejoe on Dec 25, 2009 1:18:46 GMT -5
I gave my machinist the prototype today.I will have them soon.Merry Christmas
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Post by rexxer on Dec 25, 2009 10:50:00 GMT -5
littlejoe- When the sleeves arrive you might want to start a thread in(Hunting,Tactics,Tools and Reviews.) It would stay there longer for more people to see!
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Post by unloaded on Jan 13, 2010 9:22:37 GMT -5
How are these coming along? Haven't heard anything for a while.
peace. unloaded
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Post by deadon on Jan 13, 2010 16:49:11 GMT -5
Littlejoe, Where in Va do you live, Rusty
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Post by littlejoe on Jan 13, 2010 21:49:23 GMT -5
Unloaded ,I am sorry for the wait it shouldn't be much longer.I ended up using Delrin for material. Rusty ,I live in Surry County
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