Meat Hunters Favorite Deer Rifle

[petev]

Well, the previous thread on favorite deer rifles has drawn alot of responses, so I thought I'd add a twist. I have not taken that many deer, but I found that if I hit anyway near a shoulder with a .308, that the near shoulder will be destroyed. I also have found that if I shoot a deer at close range with a .35 Rem and the bullet travels into a shoulder or hindquarter, that after excising around the bullet path very minimally, that the meat if completely fit for consumption. The meat consideration is one reason that I don't use 30-06. So, fellow venison conosseurs, what is your favorite caliber is regards to getting the deer dead, AND for not destroying alot of meat? Thanks ahead of time. Pete

[ozark]

Naturally this brings to mind taking head shots which can be a bad decision if there is a chance of missing your mark. Neck shots may ruing a neck roast but nothing else. Since rimfire cartridges are generally not legal I think a small caliber with a bullet that doesn't explode but has good penetration does well. Still with me personally and knowing the zero and trusting the accuracy of the rifle used, I would take a head shot. But I would not advise that for all. Ozark

[youp50]

I have a 25-06 Remington. When loaded to a moderate 2900 fps and using a 100 grain Barnes X bullet you can eat up to the bullet hole.

[kevin k]

why dont you just shoot at heart or lungs the head shot on a deer is not good deer are always moving there head ive shot a few deer that had there jaw hanging someone tried that shot its just not ethical or fair to the animal it can be done but a lot of variables the neck shot you only have about 2 inch wide spot to hit the length of neck alot better than head but you still have big chance of loseing deer do a little tracking and ruin no meat use gun you want. kevin

[whyohe]

i think you can ruin alot of meat with a shoulder shot with any caliber depending on the bullet you use. in a 30-06 if you use a core lok or the like heavier jacketed bullet youllbe fine. i use a Hornady interbond but i do boiler room shot.

i have gotten several deer with a 44mag lever action and did shoulder shot and not alot of meat damage about a 2" circle.

[craigf]

Personally I agree with Ozark about the head shot. If I can take it, it is not a mountable rack, and it is within my range, I will take the head shot. If I can't but I can take the neck, its my second choice. I feel that it is both ethical and does not damage meat.

[ozark]

For anyone thinking of taking a head shot it is a good practice to use noise (any type) to get the deer to stare in your direction. This stops head movement for several seconds. Plenty of time to aim and squeeze off a good shot. Naturally this requires close range and a rifle and shooter that puts the bullet where aimed. Ozark

[raf]

Head shots are for those who have complete confidence in their rifle, it's zero and their own ability. I can make that shot but sometimes adrenilin comes into play to I don't take them personally. Each hunter will have to make his own choice.

[Deleted]

I quit taking head shots years ago for one reason, when the heart stops you have deer meat that is blood saturated, all the blood is still in the meat, personally I dont care for bloody meat but thats just me. 7mm08 with 120 gr barnes when I carry a rifle......Bill

[dougedwards]

No head shots for me but the base of the neck doesn't move so much. Rem700 in .243 Winchester and 100 gr Core Lokts will take em down every time but most any caliber will do if it is accurate enough.

[ozark]

Good point hillbill, that thought never entered my mind but since you brought it up it is an old hog killing practice to kill with a brain shot and then instantly bleed the animal by the use of a sharp long blade knife. I think you have just changed one mind. Mine.

[craigf]

I was told that if a head shot was taken then adreneline would not be pumped into the body of the dear changing the flavor of the meat.

[dans]

I have shot deer with a large number of different shotgun slugs, large lead conicals and pistol bullets any of these hit the shoulder and you pretty much have to throw away one or maybe both of them. I have eaten head shot deer, neck shot deer, deer that other hunters have wounded and deer that have been shot at and are running. The secret to good venison is to field dress as soon as possible and get them hung and skinned as soon as possible. The meat needs to be cooled out quickly and throughly then hung for several days at the right temperture, This produces the best tasting deer meat. You have to trim away anything that is blood shot and just keep the good clean meat. Also I bone out all my deer I don't want bone dust and marrow mixed in. When I follow the above procedures It doesn't seem to affect much how they taste no matter where they were shot.

[raf]

We used to butcher our own beef and the animal would be put down with a shot to the head with a 22 LR. This stuns the animal but doesn't kill it. The heart keeps beating. It would be immediately bled by cutting the jugular and by the time it regained consciousness it was bled out. They used to get the same results with a ball pean hammer. I think though that a head shot with a from a high powder rifle or muzzleloader would kill instantly.

[petev]

Jan 23, 2009 14:37:56 GMT -5 youp50 said:

I have a 25-06 Remington. When loaded to a moderate 2900 fps and using a 100 grain Barnes X bullet you can eat up to the bullet hole.

youp, this is exactly the feedback I was hoping for. Most of us don't have a zillion rifles, and permits to try, so hearing the experience of others is helpful. Again, the reason behind my original question is that it seems that the same shot will produce a great variance in meat lost depending on which of my rifles I use. Incidentally, youp, the 25-06 is gaining popularity around here, mostly it is said that the deer are knocked down and run less with it than some of the other calibers. Pete

[wilmsmeyer]

Dans,

Your post morrors my feelings and experience. To avoid ruined meat, a rib shot broadside is the best. Lot's of vitals there too. In that case, most guns are just right including the biggest ones.

Our camp has shot about 200 deer in the past 5-6 years. Any shoulder shot is a ruined front end with any shotgun slug and most ML loads. Archery deer are the best and a gun shot/ribs only gun shot is right there with it.

"Hang time" in the right temp is key to aging the meat. (any meat) Those who hunt in warmer climates can quarter a deer and put the chunks in black plastic bags and store in a refridgerator for 7-10 days. Then carve away, deboning with a knife. Stay away from cutting bones and keep muscle groups intact. Trim all fat and silvery tissue from the meat. Cut them up only when ready to eat.

A few times in the past we have carved the warm tenderloins from a deer and cooked them the same day. Yuck!

[chuck41]

Like petev I also have a 35 Rem and with a 180gr flat point from it is hard to beat as a deer killer that doesn't destroy a lot of meat. Unfortunately it is like my Mini-14 in that accuracy is not the greatest much beyond 100yd.

[tcmech]

I get pretty good results with my 243 loaded with 100gr sierra bullets at 2900fps. Most of the meat will be in pretty good shape, I do aim for the heart / double lung shots when I can get them, but I am flexible and willing to take a head or neck shot if the deer is standing still.

[joe21a]

If you are meat hunting don't shoot the shoulder it will be a mess with any bullet. I use 308 in the heart lung area, kind of messes up the pickled heart!!!!

[dwhunter]

Jan 23, 2009 22:25:13 GMT -5 @hillbill said:

I quit taking head shots years ago for one reason, when the heart stops you have deer meat that is blood saturated, all the blood is still in the meat, personally I dont care for bloody meat but thats just me. 7mm08 with 120 gr barnes when I carry a rifle......Bill

Bill if you will put your deer meat on ice it will draw the blood out. You simply drain daily and re-ice for about 4-5 days. By the way deer will keep on ice for 14 days.

[wasp]

i prefer the high shoulder or brachial plexus .a shot through the scapula damages the brachial plexus which controls the central nervous system thereby rendering the animal immobile. It knocks the animal out and it never regains consciousness, the deer doesn't even have time to blink, let alone run off. this shot stops
the heart, lungs and the nervous system instantaneously. if you are a little high you get a spine shot, a little low and you get heart, a little back you get double lung, good all around shot.

[ozark]

No personal experience with the 45-70 but have read that the early hunters loved the slow moving blunt bullet because it didn't damage much meat passing through. Here when they used dogs the hunters used a lot of semi-automatic rifles in 30-06, .308, class and I have seen deer shot up so bad that saving any meat was difficult. To me this was not harvesting deer but a wild and reckless venture. It was pathetic to hear the dogs and then the rifle fireing at frequent spots along the chase. I would hear the firing and then hear the excited hounds pick up the track and race on to the next ambush site. If the dogs stopped barking I would breath relief and think. FINALLY, THE POOR THING HAS BEEN KILLED. This was sickening to me and I am not a squeemish person. Ozark

[petev]

The 45-70. I have also heard that it is slow moving, blunt and doesn't damage much meat. So, with my Sav. ML shooting that bullet, with the light load of 37.2 gr. AA5744, I think it should be an all round good deer load, for killing and not damaging too much meat. The slow moving, not too damaging bullets that come to mind are: 30-30, .35 Rem, .44 Mag, and 45-70. Maybe a .243 is less damaging than .308 and 30-06 and other big, high velocity rounds, but I don't know first hand, and haven't heard.
To be honest, I have two centerfire deer rifles, .35 Rem pump for walking and close shots such as in brushy areas, and .308 for longer shots, such as near a field. I do also have a third, the .243 . I do not need this third rifle, but I just like a .243 and finally broke down and bought one a couple of years ago.

[ozark]

If the .243 isn't the most popular center fire deer cartridge now I expect that it will soon be. It is my favorite and a confidence builder. I have used it on several deer and even with over the counter ammunition it is......Awesome. I have some handloads now that are everything that I could ask for. Accurate, light recoil, deadly, and IMO unbeatable.

[Buckrub]

Me and Jack O'Connor vote for the .270........just don't try using Hornady LM Interbonds......I now use Winchester 130g Ballistic Tip Supremes.

(I personally saw a deer that had been shot (and hit) 4 times with a .45-70 405g bullet get up and walk off........never found)...... I hunted for years with a .30-30 and spent countless hours tracking them down, but found them. Shot a .30-06 for years till I got the .270, haven't shot it since. If I got another gun (a man can't own too many guns, that's a Man Law) it'd be a .280, just so I could personally compare it to the .270......though I know it's awfully close. I hunt in some thick forests, but there are too many 200 to 300 yard shots possible to even consider a .35 or a .30-30 or such. Most stands have 20 yard shots, 70 yard shots, 250 yard shots, etc., all in one stand.

I looked at the new .308 X by Marlin.....as a 'different' type of gun and cartridge, but I don't really hunt where I'd use it.

Not a lot of folks around here use the .308, although that's the gun of choice for most LR match shooters.....it, and the .243, don't have enough knock down power for me.....if the shot isn't perfect.

As to shot placement, that is probably dictated by field conditions. When skinning a deer that I believe I shot broadside, I almost always find the two holes nowhere near straight across from each other. Shot placement is seemingly always discussed by where a fellow aims and the entry hole. It's where you put the crosshairs. But that probably isn't the true shot placement, once the bullet enters the animal. Don't y'all ever watch CSI?

I love this discussion though. If you can shoot it well, any gun is a good 'un.

[petev]

The thread keeps getting better! I continue to be bewildered at the general impression of .308, not just on the thread, but in talking to people, and from the fact that it is steadily declining in popularity. The ballistics are higher for it than for .243 and .270, it is deadly accurate, and the recoil is less than for 30 06. It is an overpowered .243, or more accurately the .243 is a smaller derivative of .308 . Military people seem particularly fond of the .308 (7.62 X 54 mm), and a few Vietnam veterans have told me that they really would have liked to have carried an M14, but weren't allowed to. I haven't shot many deer, but one that I shot at 300 yards with a .308 was DRT. Maybe I am just old fashioned. I shy away from modern clothing in favor of wool, etc.

[ozark]

The .270 is a fine cartridge in a large family of fine cartridges. Is it better than one on either side? Since they can be loaded up or down I think not. Knock down power? Hang a deer carcass on a rope and fire a bullet through it. It quvers but doesn't sway. Shock? Nerve spasms, muscle collapse I con't know.
I put the cartridges into famlies rather than a specific one. I visualize where the bullet is going after the exit so I am aware of entry, exit and the body parts in between the two.
Buckrub, I can't knock the .270 and Jack O'Conner sold a million which I am sure helped himself and the economy. Ozark

[Buckrub]

OK, I was wrong then.

[killitgrillit]

Petev,
I'am a meat hunter and my go to gun is a kimber montana in .308. I load my own using benchmark powder 165gr sierra HPBT and there only going about 2350FPS. This load drasticaly cuts down on blood shot meat and damage. I work at a deer cooler and study all the deer that come in and ask what cal. they where shot with and have found the slower the velocity the less damage and this bullet stays together unlike ballistic tips and I always get two holes with blood pouring out.
I place all my shots just behind the front should and go for the double lunger and heart, sure they may run 60-70 yards but there running dead.
Just my .02 cents worth

[orion]

Good Post,

I have shot many deer with the 45-70 with various bullet weights and velocities and it all matters where you hit them. Generally if you hit them in the shoulders, you will ruin a lot of meat. They all die if hit well, much like 12 gauge slugs.

I like the 308 and bought one ( a used sako carbine) once in case I ever hunt in rifle legal areas here in Michigan. Thing shoots like crazy, but never killed any thing with it. I have killed a few deer with the 30-06 and can say baa- it all matters where you hit them, and I don't believe any deer can tell the difference between a 308,06 or 300 mag.

Lots of people around me go north and hunt with SKS rifles. I always thought they were junk until I shot a few. I know people who made many one shot kills with them. I did some penatration tests with an SKS, a 308, and a 300 win mag side by side and the results quite frankly astounded me, not a whole lot of difference between the 3, yes differnet bullets buts still very supprising.

My buddy just bought a 243 win weatherby with comp stock at a gun show, with cheap scope and case, new for $400 out the door. Nice deer rig. He even had it magnaported for his daughter which I thought was overkill, but that is one sweet rifle now, and sure would use it if I was not always in the shot gun/muz zone.

Thats the beauty of this thread to each his own.