New build started - need advice on primers

[josh]

So I ordered a barrel (458), I have an action, stock, plug and bolt nose ordered. So while I'm waiting for stuff to show up, let's talk primers for smokeless Remington ML builds using Luke's plug. 

I hunt October up here, so it's not real cold, but 0 F isn't uncommon either.



Whats the go-to primer?  

[fishhawk]

My advice is a .458 barrel, Arrowhead plug, and Hunter bolt nose kit, Tungsten Carbide .030" bushing, all from Arrowhead Sporting Goods. Give Luke a call at Arrowhead, he will fix you up!

[josh]

Barrel ordered. 

[josh]

Now let's talk primers.

[smokeeter]

I've had great results with Fed 209A and CCI mag.primers, both fit my breech plugs equally well with no blow by

[josh]

Thanks Paul. I was going to shoot you an email asking - but I thought you would be tired of my questions by now.

[smokeeter]

keepem coming,I'll try to answer them if I can

[7mmfreak]

Federal primers have the most consistent length (which is more important to me than roundness) and they are the hottest. My second choice would be CCI.

[Richard]

If they wind up sticking, you might want to go with the Win. 209's. Of probably upwards of 15,000 SML shots I have fired (and documented), 98% have been with the Winchesters. All my sticky primers have been either or both the CCI 209 mag and the Fed. 209A.
Part of this is due to the depth in Luke's primer pocket. He sells a shim kit that will rectify it. The reason the Winchesters don't stick is they have a shoulder about .002" fatter that seals really well. Just my thoughts!

[Deleted]

If I'm not mistaken lots of guys are using the arrowhead plug and it's very rare to hear of anyone having an issue. I would move forward without worry!

[lwh723]

Mar 7, 2016 21:31:34 GMT -5 Richard said:

If they wind up sticking, you might want to go with the Win. 209's. Of probably upwards of 15,000 SML shots I have fired (and documented), 98% have been with the Winchesters. All my sticky primers have been either or both the CCI 209 mag and the Fed. 209A.
Part of this is due to the depth in Luke's primer pocket. He sells a shim kit that will rectify it. The reason the Winchesters don't stick is they have a shoulder about .002" fatter that seals really well. Just my thoughts!

The shims are not intended for use with the 700ML. If primer pocket is properly fit, the 700ML will feed (and seal) all primers just fine without a shim kit.

[Dave W]

Mar 8, 2016 8:46:20 GMT -5 lwh723 said:

Mar 7, 2016 21:31:34 GMT -5 Richard said:

If they wind up sticking, you might want to go with the Win. 209's. Of probably upwards of 15,000 SML shots I have fired (and documented), 98% have been with the Winchesters. All my sticky primers have been either or both the CCI 209 mag and the Fed. 209A.
Part of this is due to the depth in Luke's primer pocket. He sells a shim kit that will rectify it. The reason the Winchesters don't stick is they have a shoulder about .002" fatter that seals really well. Just my thoughts!

The shims are not intended for use with the 700ML. If primer pocket is properly fit, the 700ML will feed (and seal) all primers just fine without a shim kit.

Maybe they are buying the factory seconds from the other guy.

I use Fed 209A's.

[Richard]

Once you have the bolt nose touching the breech plug, or just about, that would be the furthest you could push the primer in. With my Arrowhead plug, I still had .017" from the bottom of the primer to the shoulder inside the plug. In order to correct that you would need to: #1, cut the nose back .017" and then cut the barrel shoulder back .017" which is beyond what most shooter have the capability of doing themselves? Without doing that, you need the sides of the primer itself to seal and that is what the Winchesters do. Federal's seem to seal ok but due to the gap, are not pressed back against the bolt face causing the primer to come back out of the cup and cause sticking. The CCI's have always leaked on one side in several different builds. I have discussed this with Elkman and in fact, sent my rifle up to him and he concurred. He made a new bolt nose and breech plug to rectify the problem.
I was under the impression that a plug with a more shallow depth for the primer was forth coming to rectify the problem?

[lwh723]

We've been over this a lot... but one more time...

There's not a problem to rectify. If someone has a lathe, they can easily modify BP and barrel to zero headspace in bottom of pocket. No idea why a new BP and bolt nose were needed unless you really just wanted to try your buddy's system? (Surprised you didn't just take care of this yourself?) With a prefit, it's obvious (or should be obvious) that you can't get perfect head space on every gun. If you know of a way to do this, please tell me? This is why I have the breech plug pockets machined so tight. On prefits, if care is taken when fitting the plug and the bottom 1/3 or so of the pocket is not opened up. You will not get leakage on either CCI of FED primers. And you definitely won't get sticking. If you're getting either of those, you didn't fit your plug pocket correctly. For people not comfortable doing this, I have always offered to do it before shipping.

For the Savage CF's conversions, I should have a new bolt head in a week or two that allows 0.230"+ of primer insertion which will remove any need to shim on those guns.

And... I'll go ahead let the cat out of the bag. For the 10ML-II's, I'll have a replacement bolt head in about a month that will also allow 0.230"+ of primer insertion and remove any need to shim.

[charles]

Can't be said any better .