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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 14:35:33 GMT -5
I am trying to make my decision to do a 700ml conversion. My question for those who have done it or shot them what kind of accuracy can I expect out of it when done? This will be a target gun for punching holes in paper or knocking over silhouettes. I intend to continue to use black powder or substitute. I just don't want to puta bunch of money into something only to end up with pie plate accuracy at 100 yards.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 14:47:01 GMT -5
If sub MOA is pie plate size you need to get a bigger pie! Just go for it, you will be blown away. All the barrels available for these will drive tacks that rival center fire builds, so have no worries about not having an accurate piece when you are finished.
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Post by jeff on Mar 4, 2015 14:47:15 GMT -5
I have done 1 700 ml with 1/2" moa 100 yards with a pacnor barrel on a Mike's thumbhole stock with aluminum bedding block, murphy base, competition recoil lug, and 4x14x40 Leupold. Very nice piece. I'm doing a 2nd one as I write this with a brux barrel, boyds stock, ect. I have also done another 1/2 dozen Savage 45's that all had 1 MOA or better, plus another 1/2 dozen 50 cal pacnors on a savage actions. I prefer working with the savage actions. jeff~
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Mar 4, 2015 15:15:39 GMT -5
Mine has shot a 5 shot group of 5/8 and.my last outing after fouling my barrel back to accuracy shot 4 in to .434 center to center .considering bullet diameter is .451....I a. Tickled pink. Let me know if you need a donor action drop
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 15:21:06 GMT -5
I have an offer in on a pair of them so my. Son can play too just waiting to hear back. Sub MOA at 100 yards will get me where I want to go I think.
Do you have to have a fouled barrel to get accuracy from them?
I was thinking of using a Brux barrel and a swager for the bullets.
Not sure this is the right approach.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 15:24:00 GMT -5
Brux is the way to go IMO, properly done they shoot VERY well
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Mar 4, 2015 15:37:41 GMT -5
Mine dont like a squeaky clean barrel. After a thorough cleaning it takes about 8-10 shots to settle back in. Then an occasional swab with hoppes#9
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 15:48:36 GMT -5
Good to hear I am on the right track.
How do these rifles shoot before the conversion?
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Post by dannoboone on Mar 4, 2015 16:10:50 GMT -5
How do these rifles shoot before the conversion? Never shot mine before converting, and have wondered how it would have shot. I wanted it strictly for smokeless conversion. Please shoot yours before as well as after. I have read that it's "luck of the draw", but can't confirm that.
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 16:21:00 GMT -5
I plan to shoot it just to see.
Is the Remington stock usable for this or am I going to need a Boyd's or similar?
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Post by 153 on Mar 4, 2015 16:42:46 GMT -5
I shot mine before conversion with the Remmy breech plug, lots of blowback and about 2.5" group with 100gr bh209 and 250 SST in a sabot. Might have done better with a new breech and bolt nose kit.
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Post by tnhunter54 on Mar 4, 2015 17:22:15 GMT -5
I have a Brux barrel on mine and it will shoot with the best of the center fires and maybe better, you can't go wrong with a Brux.
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Post by rossman40 on Mar 4, 2015 17:28:33 GMT -5
I have built several that, in the hands of a good trigger puller, will shoot .5 MOA shooting sabotless with both Pacnor and McGowen barrels once dialed in.
I had one customer shoot two back-to-back .6 3-shot groups using Luke's 310gr for the first time and the guy next to him (a benchrest shooter) looked at his targets and when he learned it was a muzzleloader said there was no way a ML could do that and said he was probly pulling one off the target. My customer said "I'll tell you what, I'll load it and you shoot it". So the guy agreed and ended up shooting a .4 3-shot group.
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 17:32:36 GMT -5
Rossman was that shooting smokeless? How would that differ from using black powder or substitute like buckhorn? Thanks
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Post by dannoboone on Mar 4, 2015 17:41:58 GMT -5
I plan to shoot it just to see. Is the Remington stock usable for this or am I going to need a Boyd's or similar? It can be used, however, the conversion barrels are larger in diameter, so the forearm has to be opened up quite a lot. That makes the tupperware even flimsier so it needs some reinforcement. I didn't believe it was worth the hassle and just got a Boyd's. I like the Pro Varmint customized for a better recoil pad and, being a wood lover, mine is "forest camo".
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Post by bestill on Mar 4, 2015 17:55:03 GMT -5
A brux1-20 twist build will shoot easily sub moa with blackhorn or Blackpowder but obviously bullet choice will have to match the powder you choose.
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 18:13:41 GMT -5
Dannybone I was looking at that same stock. Diddnt know if it would be too light. It sure is pretty though.
Be still that makes sense. I know it will take some toying.
I wanted a target stock, but diddnt find anything I thought was reasonable in price. I like the M40 stock I think B&C makes them.
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Post by bestill on Mar 4, 2015 18:16:07 GMT -5
IMO the factory barrel will not get the accuracy your after. A heavy load of blackhorn and 270 emax will get you submoa Or heavy paperpatch lead bullet and swiss powder will do the same.
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 18:18:24 GMT -5
Based on what it am reading I think you are right, but admittedly I don't know much!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 18:26:58 GMT -5
So no intention of using smokeless?
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Post by bestill on Mar 4, 2015 18:32:48 GMT -5
You can't go wrong with a brux450/458 barrel1-20 twist. If go with Parker bullet your going to need a smooth form die and spinjag tips for ramrod and other necessary items like powder scale. The cost per shot of blackhorn and parkers will be $3 per shot but extremely accurate. If go Blackpowder alot cheaper and extremely accurate with still several accessories. Keep reading board post full of info.. keep in mind smokeless load and blackhorn loads take a bit of a different approach to between shot routine and bullet fitment.
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Mar 4, 2015 18:49:00 GMT -5
Dannybone I was looking at that same stock. Diddnt know if it would be too light. It sure is pretty though. Be still that makes sense. I know it will take some toying. I wanted a target stock, but diddnt find anything I thought was reasonable in price. I like the M40 stock I think B&C makes them. I love it...anyone else catch it...DannyBone....I'm sorry just thought it was funny....lololololo I know it was a typo...but a good one Drop
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 21:29:08 GMT -5
Thanks for the replies, I started reading here about 3 weeks ago, recently registered. I really appreciate the wealth of knowledge and the willingness to share it.
I guess I may at some point try smokeless but at this time I am not intending to.
I really want to see this gun punch holes at 1000 yards..... Just punching paper here...
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Mar 4, 2015 21:32:59 GMT -5
I have read here that conbverting over to a Hunter boltnose kit and shooting it stock gets good results. drop
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 21:37:21 GMT -5
Your expectations sound pretty extreme for a first build. 1000yds is a good lob with a 45 but you will be happy with it if you use it within it's limitations. If you're looking specifically to use bh209 try asking questions on the smoker board. Those guys will be on top of that.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2015 22:09:51 GMT -5
bestill can give you all the info you need for the blackhorn loads/ bullet combos
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Post by rio on Mar 4, 2015 22:42:16 GMT -5
Thanks fellas, I know it's a big stretch. Not even sure I have the ability to pull it of if the gun is up to it. Just seems like if a confederate soldier with a patch ball and black powder could do it,,, well with all our tech we aught to be able to... But if the finished product is capable of the accuracy described her I will be happy.
Is there anything more accurate than the 700 ml setup?
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Post by dannoboone on Mar 4, 2015 23:45:37 GMT -5
Jeff Hankins probably gets the best accuracy out of his builds based on 700 CF actions, but you're gonna pay. DannyBoone
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Post by rangeball on Mar 5, 2015 9:58:11 GMT -5
I have read here that conbverting over to a Hunter boltnose kit and shooting it stock gets good results. drop The big knock against a stock 700ml is the ignition system. A hunter boltnose kit is a must. Remington makes a quality barrel, the one I took off my action was a .50 and nice and shiny, clean rifling and was consistent from muzzle to breech. However it was also about .503 on the lands. The problem with stock barrel is unless you have one of the rare .45s you will be limited to sabots. You can shoot the same bullets saboted in a .50 you would sabotless in a .45, so you could just do the bolt nose conversion, try it saboted and see if accuracy is where you want it before investing in a barrel. My guess is with sabots you will find accuracy problematic at the greatly extended ranges you are talking about. On the stock, the stock synthetic is kind of flimsy, but again you could stick with it and if saboted accuracy is lacking try bedding it then going with a nice laminate like a boyds.
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Post by rio on Mar 5, 2015 13:11:02 GMT -5
As far as stocks go, can I use any. Stock made for a 700 with my barrel contour?
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