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Post by jims on Sept 16, 2014 19:43:07 GMT -5
SW had a tutorial on "headspacing" a barrel if you look that up.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2014 20:07:38 GMT -5
What is the hole size that the powder sits on...? If you opened it up and not the area where the primer is "flame channel" then you expose your primers to high pressure which is what I'm seeing....Put a new stock .030 ventliner in the plug,loosen barrel nut and tighten the barrel to zero headspace then back off 1/4 turn,tightn nut and see where you are primer depth wise...
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Post by acmetim on Sept 16, 2014 21:19:56 GMT -5
So going back over sw's "head spacing thread I think I see where I went wrong... Seems I drilled the primer pocket too deep. If I understand correctly, which I clearly didn't before, what I am looking for in this set up is both ends of the primer touching- the fore end bottoming out on the primer pocket hole, while the rear end is pressed against the bolt face- all with the primer carrier just kissing the breech plug. Correct? Primer pocket was too deep on the last one. So I'll take a new untouched factory breech plug that I have and a new vent liner and make that happen. Sound like I'm on the right track?
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Post by acmetim on Sept 16, 2014 21:39:00 GMT -5
Sml, hole size was .030. I shot this as black powder for a couple years and that hole would close up little by little. I'd take a .030 wire bit and turn it by hand to clear the fire channel
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2014 22:09:30 GMT -5
Sml, hole size was .030. I shot this as black powder for a couple years and that hole would close up little by little. I'd take a .030 wire bit and turn it by hand to clear the fire channel I'm just trying to figure out why you are having high pressure signs,other than bullet fit....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2014 22:22:36 GMT -5
Is there a build up of carbon or "crud" in the primer flame channel? If there is, clean it out and try that. Another thing to try is, screw the barrel nut all the way onto the barrel and bottom it out. By doing this, the barrel is screwed into the action as far is it will go, therefore bringing the plug father back and seating the primer deeper. The primers will be very tight in the primer pocket, or even impossible to close the bolt at first. Use a "C' size drill bit (.242"), and open up the primer pocket until the primer fits in nice and snug. That way the primer is seated in the primer pocket as far as it can possibly go.
Good luck
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2014 22:37:06 GMT -5
If I were you I'd get a new factory breech plug along with new vent liners.. Do not drill the.flame channelout or the vent hole out.You're getting a dangerous amount of back pressure.You can re-headspace when you get them.. In normal circumstances those are low pressure loads you're shooting...BE SAFE Zen
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Post by hunter on Sept 17, 2014 5:16:56 GMT -5
acmetim, I don't think the savage plug is designed for the primer to bottom out on the shoulder of the plug. The shoulder is too deep. You need to keep the flame channel opened up like mentioned above. The .030 wire is not big enough to clean the flame channel, you need a 5/32 bit to go into the vent liner but not thru it. Then a c bit or 7/32" bit to the shoulder which is only about a 1/4" deep. Just do not drill thru the vent liner with these bigger bits. The .030 is for the ventliner hole only.
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Post by acmetim on Sept 17, 2014 7:36:43 GMT -5
Hunter, that is where I was going next... Last night I took a new factory breech plug and went through the tutorial on head spacing with it.. Tutorial says to use a size c drill bit until primer sits 2/3 of the way into plug. I just used the size c drill bit by hand to remove the black coating on the walls of the primer pocket- no drilling, just opening it up some- the Winchester 209's required pressure from the bolt to go in the breech plug as sent from the factory. Taking the coating off of the sides of the primer pocket gave it a snug, but easy fit. It also allowed the primer to fall all the way in to the lip of the primer. Now I remember why last time I removed metal from the rear face of the breech plug. I was trying to get the primer to only go in 2/3 of the way... Luke has a breech plug with a crush fit. I'll call him today. In my last post... Is that the primer fit I am looking for? Snug in the pocket, primer holder just kissing the face of the breech plug and primer resting solidly on the bolt face?
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Post by acmetim on Sept 17, 2014 21:35:28 GMT -5
just spent some time and money on the phone with luke. i had no idea that i could wear out a factory ventliner in so few shots. but after about 30 i guess is when the bulging started, and it didnt get better. i will attempt to measure the opening just for giggles, but in the meantine ordered a breech plug with the tungsten liner from him. hope this is all i was missing. thanks for your help.
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Post by hunter on Sept 18, 2014 3:45:51 GMT -5
Did you check the vent liner to see how big the opening is? Depending on loads but the carbon builds up in the flame channel fairly fast. You can get primer sticking with a new vent if the flame channel is carboned up to much. I would guess that you need to clean out the flame channel as soon as you start getting sticky primers and see if that doesn't cure your problem. When you get the bushing plug installed you will probably still get the build up in the flame channel and get the primer issue. If you can clean the plug every 20-30 shots may solve your problem.
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Post by acmetim on Oct 7, 2014 13:11:36 GMT -5
lemme resurrect this with an update... took her out again. this time with a tungsten lined breech plug from luke at arrowhead. went much better. not sure, however, that it was the factory breech plug that was giving me grief though..... heres what i noticed. every 9 shots i would remove and inspect the breech plug and make sure it wasn't seizing up(a habit from when i used to shoot black powder) the second time i over snugged the breech plug and to my surprise noticed that i had turned the barrel. tightening the plug is loosening the barrel. as every savage i had rebarreled before was centerfire i was heeding advice from those guys and not going too crazy on tightening the barrel nut. it was just loose enough that with the leverage of the breech plug remover i was loosening it. so i re-set it and tightened the crap out of it, and made some witness marks so that i can easily check from now on. no more problems with primers.
i had pre measured charges with me from 66 to 69 grains of h 4198. last time i seemed to be doing best with 66gr... this time groups got tighter all the way up to 69 gr. i am shooting consistently 2" groups at 100 yds- good enough to hunt with here, but i suspect that on my next range trip my groups will tighten up with higher than 69 grains of h4198. 275 parker b.e. ( i used to shoot better than that with sabots and factory barrel) i got a new batch of parkers from luke as well and didn't have the occasional loose one either.
not content with it yet, but on the right path.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2014 14:50:46 GMT -5
Sounds like you are headed in the right direction. Personally I'd put a slight knurl on the 275 BE's if they aren't real snug and try both veggie and wool wads under them and see if it doesn't tighten up even more. I believe 70gr of 4198 is a highly touted go to load with that 275. Glad you're headed down the right road.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2014 18:30:53 GMT -5
It sounded like the barrel was turning out to begin with...glad you got it figured out ..the accuracy should only get better from now...
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