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Post by Richard on Apr 28, 2009 18:48:25 GMT -5
Well, Herman, our friend Bill and myself were back at it again ;D I had just received an order from Midway and included 100 of those Renier plated lead 200 gr. .40 cal. hollow point bullets to try. They look just like the XTP's and thought I would give them a try. I did! but not a valid test. I shot three of them with the tan mmp's, 60 gr. of Re-7 and they were on the loose side and did not group that well.......minute of deer, but thats all. I then switched to the Harvester blue crush sabots for the last two shots. Higher velocity by poor two shot group. Next, since the wind was cooperating (for a while) I decided to try my new "go-to" load at 200 yards(.40 cal. 200 gr. XTP, Har. Blue Crush and 56 gr. of H-4198). My first shot was 8" low of POA (based on last weeks "dead on") and I told Herman I had a "one holer" going ;D. After the second shot, my friend Bill said: "they are both touching!"  Now with Herman eyeballing the target thru his scope, I lit off the third shot! I just knew it was less than half MOA. But, since I like five shot groups, I went ahead and fired two more into the group. The fourth shot made it a 1.971" and the fifth a 3" group. The wind was not totally cooperating. All day long we had gusting cross and tail winds. My 7th. and last group for the day was the same 56 gr. H-4198 only with the 195 Barnes. The wind was again giving me some problems and as you can see, the group kind of spread wide. Still, 3.5" was not too bad. Note how the drop from POA with the Barnes, was only 4" vs. 8" with the XTP? Needless to say, a .700" three shot 200 yard group made this (former) .50 Savage shooter feel "purty good!" You can see from my list that I played with various combinations and got mixed results. Even so, they were by and large better than the .50! Richard    |
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Post by Harley on Apr 28, 2009 19:52:14 GMT -5
.7" at 200 yards would make anyone else's day, Richard, but I remember your saying that the occasional good "lucky" 3-shot group landed the shooter on the "boy" side of separating the men from the boys; so I'm sure you're not going to be satisfied until you have all five in that .7" circle. If I'd been shooting your rifle, I'd have stopped after the third shot and congratulated myself.
Harley
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Post by Dave W on Apr 28, 2009 20:10:00 GMT -5
Good shooting, especially those first 3 shots on #2 . It is rough dealing with the wind with these things, that is for certain. |
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Post by Jon on Apr 28, 2009 20:24:01 GMT -5
Richard, I'm glad to see you can enjoy working with what you can get down range instead of looking for what will make your barrel work.
Jon
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Post by younghunter86 on Apr 28, 2009 20:53:04 GMT -5
Richard-
Nice shooting, and great range report as usual. I don't think I would have been able to pull the trigger on shots 4 and 5. I would have been shaking so bad, knowing that Herman was watching at the same time.
Tough question for you to answer, but overall, do you see more promise in the blue harvester or the crush rib version?
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Post by Richard on Apr 28, 2009 21:08:26 GMT -5
Its a little early to tell..........The Crush Rib seems to go down the barrel easier. Is that because there is less surface area in contact with the bore or is it just a looser fit? I am still working with both but right now the edge (no pun intended ;D) goes to the plain blue Harvestor.
Richard
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Post by rexxer on Apr 28, 2009 21:11:29 GMT -5
Atta Boy Harley- Richard had that coming! ;D
Nice shooting Rich!!!
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Post by Richard on Apr 28, 2009 21:46:33 GMT -5
Younghunter86...........Actually, I just mic'ed the plain against the crush rib with an XTP and the plain is .0008" fatter. So, the extra thickness plus the fact the ribs cause less friction, and you have a looser feeling fit. I did shoot some knurled SST's in the crush rib, but they still seemed to slide down the bore with less resistance. Maybe I need more knurling?
Richard
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Post by younghunter86 on Apr 28, 2009 22:51:37 GMT -5
Younghunter86...........Actually, I just mic'ed the plain against the crush rib with an XTP and the plain is .0008" fatter. So, the extra thickness plus the fact the ribs cause less friction, and you have a looser feeling fit. I did shoot some knurled SST's in the crush rib, but they still seemed to slide down the bore with less resistance. Maybe I need more knurling? Richard Richard- Thanks for the followup(s). The reason I asked is that I just ordered a bunch of of plain blue harvesters, and was wondering if I should get some of the crush ribs as well. All this waiting is making me second guess everything that I have on hand. Reason being, I Just called today about my barrel, at the earliest it will be shipped next week. Funny thing is I called last week monday, and said it should be going out THIS week. So essentially things are going backwards and am hoping it will be here by the 4th of July!  |
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Post by Richard on Apr 29, 2009 15:55:17 GMT -5
Its well worth the wait and it will not take you too long to have it driving tacks! As dave d advised: 56 gr. H-4198, a plain blue Harvester and a 200 gr. .40 XTP (I have not tried the SST's yet with the combo, but should work also) and your in business. Now that I know it will shoot with that combination, I will proceed to play with many other loads attempting to get the velocity up with good accuracy.
Richard
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2009 17:13:57 GMT -5
Richard, I am shooting the plain blue but also shooting ssts and its a very nice fit. I agree on the five shot groups, three are too boreing for the new barrels, good report and a steady finger...Bill
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Post by dave d. on Apr 29, 2009 18:43:13 GMT -5
:)richard nice shooting.glad to see you are a happy camper.keep shootin ;D.
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Post by Richard on Apr 29, 2009 19:29:25 GMT -5
Thank you Dave! I am glad you got this Pac-Nor project off the ground. I think you have brought a  to many a frustrated Savage .50 owner. At least the ones who are looking for more than just putting meat on the table. Richard |
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Post by rexxer on Apr 29, 2009 21:20:28 GMT -5
Hi Richard
Do you know your bore dia land to land. Looks like you got her going! The olny bullet that doesn't seem to group for me is the 195 Grain Barnes. It seems to load a littler looser than the sst with the reg. blue sabot.
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Post by chuck41 on Apr 30, 2009 0:06:47 GMT -5
Don't give up on those 200 Ranier 40s. I have shot a bunch of them in my 50 and my 40 and for me they work almost identical with the XTPs, at least at 100yd. I don't have a 200yd range to try them on though.
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Post by Richard on Apr 30, 2009 13:11:27 GMT -5
Chuck...........No, I don't plan on giving up on the Reniers! As a matter of fact, I am going to try them again this coming week and shoot them with the same combination that did so well with the 200 XTP's: 56gr. - H4198 and the Blue Harvestor.
Also what I plan on doing is firing five shot groups with that combination only switching the sabots: Harvestor Blue, Harvestor Blue crush rib, mmp tan and Knight brown. Both the tan and brown mic about .002" fatter. If the conditions are good, this should give me a decent indication of which sabot to "load up on!"
Richard
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Post by dave d. on Apr 30, 2009 14:03:07 GMT -5
:)Richard,I would be shocked if the light blue's are'nt the best groupers.don't think because those mmp's are tighter that they going to be better because that theory goes right out the window with these barrels.the harvestor sabot is stronger and better.goodluck I look forward to your results.
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Post by Richard on Apr 30, 2009 20:12:47 GMT -5
dave d...........If you think I will be wasting bullets and powder and have already proven it, maybe I'll turn my attention to other loads and just stick with the blue Harvestors! Or, have you actually tested all four with the same combination at the same time? I have no complaints with the blue Harvestors, just curious to know it the others might also work?
Richard
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Post by sw on May 2, 2009 7:03:47 GMT -5
Richard, I too, like the light blue Harvesters better than the Knight and MMPs. Thinnest/toughest - Harvester, next - Knight(darker brown), then the thickest - MMP - (tan). I think most of the 45 PacNors are tight enough bored for the Harvesters. That said(I have 3 different diameter 45s), there needs to be a fairly snug fit. A tighter fit with the Knight or MMP is better than a loose fit with the Harvester. I've found that the WWs help(haven't tried 45 cal veg wads - if they exist). Remember that a tighter fit can be obtained with the same sabot by knurling the bullet.
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Post by dave d. on May 2, 2009 8:11:59 GMT -5
:)richard i've tested 3 out of the 4(haven't tried the dark brown knights) and have never been able to beat the standard light blue harvestors..449 to .451 bore sizes have shot the light blues light's out so i hope this helps you out.
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Post by sagittarius on May 2, 2009 8:48:13 GMT -5
Good report, Rich; always enjoy them.  I use the blue CR Harvester because the owner recommended them over the standard because they're easier to load. They almost seemed too easy when I first loaded them into my Pac-Nor barrel as I can easily push them down with just one hand. They sure shoot accurately from my rifle though. |
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Post by Richard on May 2, 2009 18:47:00 GMT -5
Thanks to all! Tuesday will be another day to play games ;D
Richard
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to many a frustrated Savage .50 owner. At least the ones who are looking for more than just putting meat on the table.
