Befuddled-Non Toxic Shot

[ET]

Man I feel like going off the deep end scouring for info for reloading Non Toxic Shot-shells. It’s been years since I’ve reloaded shot-shells and then it was only lead shot.
Now there is a whack of different components and specific combinations out there.
Everyone claims to have the best to buy but from past experience marketing hype is not always 100% truthful in my book.

So my question is for re-loaders who have firsthand knowledge and experience for what actually works best for them. The recommended load combination I seek would be for large geese and ducks out to 50yds with best possible velocity & patterns achievable. Even directions for research info would be helpful for a starting point.

Been out of this neck of these woods for years and need some help/guidance to step back into this game.



Ed

[ET]

Okay, no bites so far.
Just to update my progress I have decided to first get a reloading manual from Reloading Specialties called “Steel Shotshell Reloading Handbook – Edition #8 and do a good review what is available from them. Figure just to my feet wet only by reading before plunging into new waters.
Then a Manual from Ballistic Products to see what they have available for loads and components.

For this season I have elected to try some high velocity steel shotshells from Kent.
The big thing is getting any loads pattern tested at different ranges so I shouldn’t have a lot of excuses if I miss or a lot of cripples to hunt down. The days of lead for water-fowling are gone and for me it’s back to the drawing board.


Ed

[slugger]

NON-Tox Is out of my price roage...
I have loaded Hevy shot and Bismuth, both totally different loading and components but at near $200 a bag of shot I just cant do it. I have a pet steel load that works well for me and my kind of hunting that runs right at $10 a box . Not bad for premium 3 1/2" fast 1 1/2 oz shells.
Check here they have any thing shot gun loading you can need and LOT of pamphlets for loading Non-Tox.

www.ballisticproducts.com/

[ET]

Slugger

Thanks for your response and suggestion.
I’m using an older model Remington 870-Magnum that will only take 3” shells max.
My definition as I understand Non Toxic refers to no lead so steel should also fall into this category. But I should have been more specific in my post.
Boy there is a lot of new things happening since I last looked at what is now available.
But from reading in trying to catch up some is the new shot is more temperamental to choke systems. Hope my existing Pattern Master choke tube, circa late 1980’s is up to the task.

My considered max range will probably fall at 50yds.


Ed

[esshup]

ET, I second BP products. They're good. If you are still going to roll your own, buy their "Status of Steel" reloading book - the most current edition.

You WILL need a different choke tube. Go even lighter then you think, and strictly focus on BB shot. We've stoned geese at 63 yds with BB loads. Larger shot sizes need less constriction to pattern well.

I shoot Kent 3" Fasteel BB's for geese and if the goose doesn't fall it's my fault. I'm using a IC choke tube. If you are buying factory, get the fastest Kent's that there are in 3" shells. I think there is a difference in killing power once you get past 40 yds. A choke tube with the longest parallel section works the best to stabilize the shot before it leaves the barrel - extended choke tubes for sure.

Also, I found that I had to shorten up my lead vs. shooting clay birds at a distance with shells going 1250 - 1200 fps.

[ET]

Esshup

Thanks for your response.

I also confirm about shortening the lead especially with shot-shells that are going high 1400’s to mid 1500fps.
Recently got a copy of RSI’s reloading manual and plan on getting BP copy as well.

My research so far is suggesting steel shot size #3, #2 and BB will be the loads I plan to reload for Ducks and Geese.
As for choke selection right now I’m using a Carlson Long Rang tube .700” that appears to be clobbering the geese at 40+ yards. But really need to run a good pattern test when time allows. For pond ducks I plan to use my shorter barrel adorned with a PatternMaster at .710”. Will keep in mind your suggestion about an IC choke when I do some serious pattern testing of reloads.
So far 3-local Canada’s have found their way into my freezer and some migrating birds are just starting to appear.
My favorite goose taken to date is the one I sweet talked in from over 300-yds on the water. Not having hunted migratory birds in almost 10-years I haven’t totally lost my touch calling geese but my duck calling needs some real work.

The other fun part is having to canoe to navigate the water way we hunt. Good thing my partner knows how to control a canoe. I provide good strong strokes up front and he guides us along. Okay I lost out on the controlled deer hunt this year but sort of feel reunited with my first love of hunting migratory birds.
It feels good.


Ed

[slugger]

Some loads need as much as .680 or .670...
Have to do some paper time...

[ET]

Oct 20, 2012 11:07:51 GMT -5 slugger said:

Some loads need as much as .680 or .670...
Have to do some paper time...

Slugger

You’ve got my interest somewhat in mentioning choke tubes with a smaller diameter than .700” in reference for steel shot in a 12ga. I’ve been out of game with no real time experience using steel shot but everything I read seems to indicate that is not an area you want to go. Even the two companies Carlson & PatternMaster have made mention about shot size and velocity not to use with their choke tubes in 12ga.

I’m not challenging what you are saying but would like to hear more.
For now I will be following manufacturer’s recommendation until I become more familiarized with some firsthand experience before going further in any direction. Lot more studying yet to follow along with pattern testing in my older 3”- 870 Magnum.

Alliant Steel has already been decided as my powder of choice for reloads that I want to start with. Also Gold Metal casings in 2-3/4” and plastic base 3” casings from Federal will be included in my start point.

I’m kind of itching to get started but my priority is finding a decent set of waders because I like dry feet. My old waders have seen their day and no longer dependable. With all the patches it almost looked like a battered quilt. ;D


Ed

[slugger]

I shoot a 870 supper express 3 1/2" 12 and an extended ( I cant remember for sure and I'm not near my gun) dead coyote or Hevy Metal .690 choke. There also rated for steel BUT you have to keep the speed under 1500 fps. I shoot 1 1/2 oz at 1400fps loaded with Duplex #2X BBB ,with out a problem and at 55 yards I'm dumping around 85% in a 30" target and in that I put a 10" paper plate and keep almost 40% in that. I use 8 gr of buffer and a roll crimp.
Each gun/load /choke will pattern differantly ,You have to pattern uours to see...

[ET]

Slugger

Thanks for your additional response and info.
I also agree that each shotgun should be patterned to see what combination works best.

Some of my reading seems to indicate that with steel a non-ported choke tube produces better results. Any comments you would like to share if you have any experience in this area?


Ed

[slugger]

comments you would like to share if you have any experience in this area?

Never shot a ported choke SORRY

[ET]

Oct 21, 2012 21:36:49 GMT -5 slugger said:

comments you would like to share if you have any experience in this area?

Never shot a ported choke SORRY

Slugger

Again thanks for your response.
This is one area I will have to do a little more testing on my part to satisfy my curiosity.
Once I’m satisfied with my reloads as being the best possible then I can focus on doing my part for polishing shot placement at various ranges, flight speed and angles. So far I’m not doing badly for not having used a shotgun for numerous years.

My late 4-legged buddy would be pleased if he was still around because he would get to participate in bringing birds home. I still miss not having him around to enjoy bird hunting together. We were a solid team that produced.


Ed